AMC-List Digest, Vol 11, Issue 38
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AMC-List Digest, Vol 11, Issue 38
- From: amc-list-request@xxxxxxx
- Date: Sat, 16 Dec 2006 19:35:17 +0000
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Today's Topics:
1. Re; 258 engine balance and flexplate (farna@xxxxxxx)
2. Re: Lego Car (masheen)
3. Re: An old song is a good song? (Sandwich Maker)
4. 401X Race Block (Nick ALFANO)
5. Rebel Story & $40 gallon gas (Eddie Stakes)
6. 73 Javelin for sale (Eddie Stakes)
7. 74 AMX for sale (Eddie Stakes)
8. 69-70 AMX & Javelin floor console wanted (Eddie Stakes)
9. Rebel Machine wanted/trade (Eddie Stakes)
10. 69 American for sale $450/obo (Eddie Stakes)
11. 70 AMX wanted (Eddie Stakes)
12. AMC parts for sale (Eddie Stakes)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Sat, 16 Dec 2006 14:13:05 +0000
From: farna@xxxxxxx
Subject: [AMC-List] Re; 258 engine balance and flexplate
To: mail@xxxxxxxxxxxx (AMC-List)
Message-ID:
<121620061413.23082.4583FEF10006B5AA00005A2A21602813020E029D0E00@xxxxxxx>
The only situation I can think of where the flexplate could damage the trans is if the center breaks completely out. That could let the converter slip back and forth and partially disengage from the hub or "sling" out of alignment and damage the pump and front seal.
I had that happen once on my 63 American (196, M-35). Luckily it broke loose just as I was starting to take off (just over idle speed) and the BW converter has a pilot shaft to keep it aligned. Makes a lot of noise when that happens, and barely moves even if the engine is revved up. I got it out of the road under it's own power, that was as far as I went.
The flexplate cracked (broke) around the reinforcing ring and had radial cracks. No indication of anything wrong at all until it broke loose. I replaced the torque converter because there was a crack partially around the pilot shaft, don't know if that's from when it broke loose (most likely) or when I revved the engine to move the car. I replaced it with a slightly thicker flexplate made in the aircraft shop from high grade stainless. No other damage, even the seal looked good, but I replace the front seal in an auto trans ANY time the trans comes out if it's been in there more than a few weeks. $10 seal, lots of work to drop the trans...
The 196 flexplate is just a 16-18 gauge hardened steel flat disc 10" or so (don't have exact measurement) in diameter, the starter ring gear is on the converter. Easy to make one -- I tack welded the center back in the broke one and used it to locate the bolt holes. If it hadn't been hardened steel I don't think it would have broke. A piece of 16 gauge cold rolled steel works fine as a substitute. I suggest closely inspecting any 196 flexplate when the trans is out, and even if it's original and looks good I'd replace it. Andre Jacobs (akjamc@xxxxxxxx) makes replacements. I think he doubles 18 gauge steel (you just bolt the two together on the crank).
-----------------
On Fri, 15 Dec 2006, John Elle wrote:
> The only verified bad flex plate I ever had on an automobile
> I purchased the car with it and sold it many years later
> with the flex plate still in it. It had radial cracks running
> out from the center hub. Of course it was a Cheby.
Tom Jennings replied:
The flexplate on the '73 Hornet I took the motor out had the
same type cracks; it probably made a noise but it fit together
like gear teeth so I don't think it mattered to the P.O.; it
couldn't walk around because the crack was under the bolt heads.
Even that wouldn't hurt the transmission!
--
Frank Swygert
Publisher, "American Motors Cars"
Magazine (AMC)
For all AMC enthusiasts
http://farna.home.att.net/AIM.html
(free download available!)
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Sat, 16 Dec 2006 09:26:35 -0500
From: "masheen" <masheen@xxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] Lego Car
To: <amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Message-ID: <00b801c7211e$30cd39c0$0201a8c0@bobt3dde2kltb5>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
reply-type=original
That was really kewl!! At the same site, this guy has built huge scale cars
also. He never says what scale it is, but some of you here are gonna really
like this one. Here's the link: http://www.mocpages.com/moc.php/19420 and
yet another: http://www.mocpages.com/moc.php/19423 The second link shows a
model based on LegoCad renderings. I bet this "LegoCad" program allows
design of practically anything. The advances of 'puter programs! Never had
anything like that when I was a kid.
Kinda interesting that this guy's name is Johannes.
Bob Rapp
Newport News, Va
70 Machine
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Sat, 16 Dec 2006 10:17:46 -0500 (EST)
From: adh@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx (Sandwich Maker)
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] An old song is a good song?
To: mail@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <200612161517.kBGFHkT07638@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
" From: "John Elle" <johnelle@xxxxxxxxx>
"
"
"
" Snip
" it is my understanding
" that internal or external balance is a decision made by the designer.
" Even the legendary Chevy small block which is internal balanced as I
" understand, the 400 cu in version of it is externally balanced leaving
" one to do some extra work when installing a 400 crank in a 350 to make
" the popular stroker 383 due to the external balance configuration of the
" 400 crank, as I understand it.
"
" yeah, but comparing a v to an inline is an apples-and-oranges thing.
" Snip
"
" Yuh, agreed, but it seems to me that I compared a commonly available
" engine with multiple parts interchangeability that can be found as
" both internal or externally balanced depending on the displacement of
" the thing.
you did, but i don't see how that's relevant. chevy shorted the
counterweights on the 400 to make it easier to fit the long stroke
into the crankcase. the extra counterweight mass must be added to the
flywheel and/or damper.
v8 cranks are commonly not fully counterweighted - eg. weights either
side of every throw - but afaik even internally balanced v8s cannot be
made without some counterweights, and they must be rebalanced whenever
you change rod or piston weight. the rr silver ghost inline six had
no counterweights. jeep 'stroker' engines - 4.0 blocks with 258
cranks - can use either 258 rods and 4.0 pistons or 4.0 rods and
custom pistons without rebalancing - and no, the custom pistons aren't
made extra heavy to make up for the lighter 4.0 rods. [258 rods are
heavy because the forging is also used for v8 rods]
i've heard of several externally balanced v8s but no inline sixes.
i've asked machine shops about balancing a six and they all have told
me they don't need it. that's not to say they're completely right; in
thinking about it i can see how the whole assembly can be balanced but
have internal unbalances that cancel out. i'm sure this is why bmw
cranks have 12 equal counterweights.
" The point being, as far as I know there is nothing particularly magic
" about the number of cylinders and whether it is internal or external
" balanced. A design feature which is most probably a decision made by
" whomsoever designed the thing.
but there -is- something 'magic' - the fundamental geometry of
cylinder arrangement, and the resulting forces in the various
directions they generate!
________________________________________________________________________
Andrew Hay the genius nature
internet rambler is to see what all have seen
adh@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx and think what none thought
------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Sat, 16 Dec 2006 10:16:58 -0800 (PST)
From: Nick ALFANO <71amx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [AMC-List] 401X Race Block
To: amc list <mail@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Message-ID: <689982.19319.qm@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
Tom,
I am not sure where he got it from and there were no
heads there yet when I looked at it. He has grand
ideas of the block being worth somewhere in the area
of $2500 by itself.
Nick Alfano
Alfano Performance
Kenosha, WI. 53142
262-308-1302
262-942-8271 after 6pm central and weekends
Message: 11
Date: Fri, 15 Dec 2006 11:06:25 -0800 (PST)
From: Tom Jennings <tomj@xxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] 401X Race Block
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID:
<Pine.LNX.4.64.0612151105450.8539@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
On Fri, 15 Dec 2006, Nick ALFANO wrote:
> I would tend to go along with you that they didn't
> really exist except I inspected it yesterday. It
does
> have the 401 cast into the side of the block, there
> definitely is an "X" stamped above the casting and
it
> is a 3.750 bore. The water jackets are much larger
> than a normal AMC V8. Looking at the size of them,
I
> doubt this engine could be bored more than .060 over
> the 3.750 bore. The oil return holes in the intake
> valley are plugged and it had 4 bolt mains at some
> point in it's life. The part number shows it is a
401
> but the bore is definitely not. There is also "401"
> cast into the valley section of the block. This is
> not some homemade job. It is definitely cast into
the
> block. The casting marks are much more pronounced
on
> this block than normal. The block has been tanked
and
> blasted down to a bare casting so there is no hiding
> what is there.
Wow, that's pretty spectacular. Where did you get it?
Where
did it come from?
Where there heads that came with it?
------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Sat, 16 Dec 2006 12:26:36 -0600
From: "Eddie Stakes" <eddiestakes@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [AMC-List] Rebel Story & $40 gallon gas
To: <baadassGremlins@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>, <mail@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Message-ID: <003d01c72140$3c0ff210$abf1b148@piageedc1iqa5q>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
reply-type=original
This is actually a dumb Rebel story. The gas gauge on my 68 Rebel
convertible "Machine" has been slightly off since the 1980s. So I keep what
shows 1/4 tank in it, and anything below that, I go fill again. After a
really foggy night and this morning, heavy 1/4 mile visibility here in
Houston, I drove the Rebel loaded with boxes to ship out at the USPS. Ho ho
ho. My plan was to ship out those items, then head down I-10 feeder to
Kirkwood, grab something to eat, go to bank, get back in time to meet Paige
who would head to work, and watch the kids.
In the 8 track (what? You don't have one in YOUR AMC???) was Foreigner and
right in middle of 'The Damage Is Done' as I approched Kirkwood on the
heavily construction zone of I-10 corridor the Rebel died. I quickly shoved
in nuetral and coasted while trying to restart. It turned over but sounded
like out of gas, not some of the other sounds one gets used to when driving
a AMC in 2006.
I coasted into the mud and got out, as I was out of traffic. The first thing
I thought was if I am out of gas, I am only a block from a Shell station on
the south side of I-10; the Chevron was razed months ago however for
widening I-10. Another problem I guess would be getting across the three
lane feeder road as it is like playing a game of Frogger and I would have to
be a otter doing so.
So I walked to Shell, and picked out a small gas can, and asked for $2 of
gas. It was $10.63. Yow, can I have a tube of KY with that! The damned gas
can was almost $8 dollars. More on it later. I went out and got my $2 of
gas, and got across the lanes again. some of the 18 wheeler guys and crane
operators had now gather around the car checking it out. Lots of nice
comments. I told them I would have it moved shortly as I only 'think' I had
run out of gas.
The gas can is a work of art. This is the stupidest gas can I have ever seen
since I got my driver's license. While the gas can is regular red plastic
looking universal type, the nozzle is the real piece of work here. The gas
can is made by Midwest Can Company, Melrose Park Illinois. It touts itself
as a 'spill proof system' and had this goofy spring loaded nozzle. So you
are supposed to push down on the nozzle to make th gas flow while holding
this 1 gal 4 oz container, all the while pushing down on a black nozzle
thing you slide over the main nozzle. This is by far the stupidest
configuration I have ever seen. And I wasted abuot $1.40 of my $2 gas as it
leaked like a sive to boot. The spring in it is very tight. It looks like I
will be washing out this and sending it to them in Chicago, as it sure as
hell ain't worth $8 + change!
I saved some gas to drop down the carb, and it fired up. Died. Dropped more
gas, fired up, died. I did this about 5 times, wished I had done it about 10
however, but battery was starting to get low trying to crank over that
powerful 401.
So I left gas can in front of car, and walked back to Shell and got on the
pay phone. You remember pay phones don't you? I figured since I live less
than 2 miles away might be able to get a free tow from the Houston Safe
Clear program, so called 311. After 5 minute wait they told me that only
applies to freeways, NOT feeder roads. Darn and it was now about 9:00 and I
had not had any coffee yet. There was a wrecker driver about 3 feet from me
while I was on the phone, as he was filling out some other paperwork. So I
hug up, and asked him if he does stray tows.
Yes, the fee is $85, but since you said you live 2 miles only $60 for you my
humble friend. Aw, ok, let's go. We drove thru and around Paige Barrels
(that is the actual name of the orange and white 55 gal barrels along the
freeways, it is the name of the company, not named after my wife who
commonly smashes into them) but we backed up to the Rebel, he dropped the
rollback, hooks, and it was on and he gave me a ride to the house.
After the car dropped in driveway, I paid him then decided to try turning it
over again. First however a peek down carb to see if it getting ags. It was.
Hmm...maybe that fuel pump was not out, maybe points or something else. I
poured a little gas down the carb, and it cranked, then died. More gas down
carb, cranked and it ran great. So it was only out of gas. I wished I had
tried to torun it over a few more times over there when it was under I-10 in
the mud, however, the battery was getting low, and of course, you have
248,000 cars passing by you on I-10, so not a good place to have hood up
troubleshooting.
The Safe Clear program Houston has is if your car breaks down on a freeway a
wrecker mysteriously appears and tows it. It is mandatory city ordinance
tow, so you get the bill unless it is 2-3 miles, then just tip the driver,
otherwise about $75-$100.
Anyhows, the Rebel is fine, except it has about 2 gallons of gas in it, and
each gallon cost me $40 a gallon this morning.
The I-10 construction mentioned is ongoing and the most expensive in Texas'
history. When finished, it will be 24 lanes. That is right, 24 lanes. Sort
of like a Texas sized game of Frogger on steroids. To see more, even though
it makes it sound like Chuck E. Cheese singing 'we are the world' ad
nauseum, go to www.katyfreeway.org I live near Section G which is the Sam
Houston Tollway/Beltway 8 @ I-10 on the west side. Lots of barrels. My own
record for sending one flying is about 30 yeards though.
Eddie Stakes
Eddie Stakes'
Planet Houston AMX
713.464.8825
eddiestakes@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
www.planethoustonamx.com
Email is currently HEAVY
5-12 day reply times, call if important
------------------------------
Message: 6
Date: Sat, 16 Dec 2006 13:13:54 -0600
From: "Eddie Stakes" <eddiestakes@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [AMC-List] 73 Javelin for sale
To: <baadassGremlins@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>, <mail@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Cc: javelinjunki@xxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <006a01c72149$7ea6ac50$abf1b148@piageedc1iqa5q>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
reply-type=original
Hello, I am selling a 1973 Javelin SST with 360,4bbl, A/C, floor shift auto.
It has tic toc dash. It runs and drives but will need interior work. Body is
solid but it does have some rust in rear lower quarters and a little in the
trunk. It does not have a title but the VIN is clear. I am asking 1000.00
obo. Trades considered. The car is in New Mexico. Chris @
javelinjunki@xxxxxxxxx
==========================================
anyone interested in the Javelin give them a shout above, thanks,
Eddie Stakes'
Planet Houston AMX
713.464.8825
eddiestakes@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
www.planethoustonamx.com
Email is currently HEAVY
5-12 day reply times, call if important
------------------------------
Message: 7
Date: Sat, 16 Dec 2006 13:13:01 -0600
From: "Eddie Stakes" <eddiestakes@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [AMC-List] 74 AMX for sale
To: <mail@xxxxxxxxxxxx>, <baadassGremlins@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Cc: 666mph@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <006901c72149$7e4c0930$abf1b148@piageedc1iqa5q>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
reply-type=original
I am looking to sell a 1974 Javelin Amx. Complete rebiuld with less than 500
miles. Original California no rust car with Blue license plates. No leaks
and runs perfect. A real head turner. 304 bored .30 over with all edelbrock
intake and carb. Duel exhuast and brand new BF goodrich T/A. Asking price is
12,000$ Will email pictures on request. Car is in Los Angeles. reply to
666mph@xxxxxxxxxxxx Craig
====================================
anyone interested in the AMX give them a shout above, thanks,
Eddie Stakes'
Planet Houston AMX
713.464.8825
eddiestakes@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
www.planethoustonamx.com
Email is currently HEAVY
5-12 day reply times, call if important
------------------------------
Message: 8
Date: Sat, 16 Dec 2006 13:29:06 -0600
From: "Eddie Stakes" <eddiestakes@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [AMC-List] 69-70 AMX & Javelin floor console wanted
To: <mail@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Cc: pkonwinski@xxxxxxx
Message-ID: <006e01c72149$7fe87b20$abf1b148@piageedc1iqa5q>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
reply-type=original
hi i am looking for a floor console for 69/70 javelin or amx in good
condition but will consider all others. thanks! paul konwinski
pkonwinski@xxxxxxx 419-836-7509
============================
anyone that can help out Paul give them a shout above, thanks,
Eddie Stakes'
Planet Houston AMX
713.464.8825
eddiestakes@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
www.planethoustonamx.com
Email is currently HEAVY
5-12 day reply times, call if important
------------------------------
Message: 9
Date: Sat, 16 Dec 2006 13:14:53 -0600
From: "Eddie Stakes" <eddiestakes@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [AMC-List] Rebel Machine wanted/trade
To: <mail@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Cc: regano@xxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <006b01c72149$7ef7b280$abf1b148@piageedc1iqa5q>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
reply-type=original
Wanted: 70 Machine for restoration at a reasonable price. I am in Calgary
Alberta Canada. 403-333-3733 or 403-590-0230. Ask for Regan, or E-mail me at
regano@xxxxxxxxx . I will consider trades on my 69 Chevelle SS396 clone car,
for a Machine. Thanks Regan
========================================
anyone interested in a trade or has car for sale give them a shout above,
thanks
Eddie Stakes'
Planet Houston AMX
713.464.8825
eddiestakes@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
www.planethoustonamx.com
Email is currently HEAVY
5-12 day reply times, call if important
------------------------------
Message: 10
Date: Sat, 16 Dec 2006 13:31:28 -0600
From: "Eddie Stakes" <eddiestakes@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [AMC-List] 69 American for sale $450/obo
To: <baadassGremlins@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>, <mail@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Cc: javelinjunki@xxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <007001c72149$80942470$abf1b148@piageedc1iqa5q>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
reply-type=original
1969 Rambler American for sale. 232 six with auto on column, the car runs
and drives very good. The body is solid but has been hit in the front. The
fender, grill, valance and bumper will need to be replaced (all removed).
The frame rail is not damaged. The car is a 2dr. The hood and radiator
support are fine. The doors and hood open fine. I need to move it because I
have too many projects, so the price is great 450.00 obo. Might trade.In
Northern NM, javelinjunki@xxxxxxxxx
================================
anyone interested in the American give them a shout above thanks,
Eddie Stakes'
Planet Houston AMX
713.464.8825
eddiestakes@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
www.planethoustonamx.com
Email is currently HEAVY
5-12 day reply times, call if important
------------------------------
Message: 11
Date: Sat, 16 Dec 2006 13:29:57 -0600
From: "Eddie Stakes" <eddiestakes@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [AMC-List] 70 AMX wanted
To: <mail@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Cc: tomandjoanne@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <006f01c72149$80398150$abf1b148@piageedc1iqa5q>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
reply-type=original
I am in the market for a 1970 AMX in the 25 to 30k price range. The car must
be orig. and in good shape ie. restored. It has to be a 390, auto , go
package, color is not inportant,all opt. are a plus like shadow mask is nice
if orig. leather, am/fm, a/cond. Tom Hellawell 208-765-6925.
tomandjoanne@xxxxxxxxxxxx
========================
anyone with one for sale give them a shout above thanks,
Eddie Stakes'
Planet Houston AMX
713.464.8825
eddiestakes@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
www.planethoustonamx.com
Email is currently HEAVY
5-12 day reply times, call if important
------------------------------
Message: 12
Date: Sat, 16 Dec 2006 13:26:49 -0600
From: "Eddie Stakes" <eddiestakes@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [AMC-List] AMC parts for sale
To: <mail@xxxxxxxxxxxx>, <baadassGremlins@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Cc: javelinjunki@xxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <006d01c72149$7f9774f0$abf1b148@piageedc1iqa5q>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
reply-type=original
1970 Javelin gas tank, good shape and usable 135.00, AMC 20 rear end off
Gremlin 250.00, 14"" Ralley wheels 45.00 ea w/o vulcano caps (25.00). Magnum
14"" wheels 45.00 ea w/o center caps (15.00 each). 68-9 Javelin Hood fair
shape 135.00. 71-74 Javelin console w/o shifter 85.00, Lower dash heater
section 75.00, '72 Javelin grill good shape 95.00. 3speed tremec trans
250.00. Prices do NOT include shipping. Some items might be pick up only.
Chris, javelinjunki@xxxxxxxxx
====================================
anyone interested in the items above give them a shout, thanks,
Eddie Stakes'
Planet Houston AMX
713.464.8825
eddiestakes@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
www.planethoustonamx.com
Email is currently HEAVY
5-12 day reply times, call if important
------------------------------
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End of AMC-List Digest, Vol 11, Issue 38
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