AMC-List Digest, Vol 10, Issue 54
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AMC-List Digest, Vol 10, Issue 54
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- Date: Tue, 28 Nov 2006 01:42:01 +0000
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Today's Topics:
1. Blasphemy (Jim Boone)
2. Re: American rear end? (Sandwich Maker)
3. Re: AMC Progress (Parts Availability) (Mr. AMC)
4. Re: American rear end? (msproviero@xxxxxxxxxxx)
5. Re: American rear end? (Mark Price)
6. Re: Blasphemy (Mark Price)
7. Re: Blasphemy (ROSS BLAIR)
8. Re: Continuing Saga of Doc the Jeep, Part II.5 (Tom Jennings)
9. Re: Blasphemy (Tom Jennings)
10. Re: ebay jav #1 amc dealer in america (Steven Clark)
11. Re: ebay jav #1 amc dealer in america (Tom Jennings)
12. '65 American For Sale (J Johnson)
13. Re: ebay jav #1 amc dealer in america (Sandwich Maker)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2006 10:52:38 -0500
From: "Jim Boone" <fljab@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [AMC-List] Blasphemy
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <BAY116-F19EDCD5EFF081AE8CBE775ACE60@xxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
Non-AMC powered cars has been and still is a subject that brings out very
vocal opinions. It's been discussed here on the list at length at different
times, usually with great debate. AMO a couple of yrs ago finally voted in
a non-AMC powered class for shows.
I have always been of the opinion that there really is no good-enough reason
to put a Cheby engine (the usual choice) in your AMC (or Ford, Mopar, etc).
There are still plenty of good engines - esp. 360's - out there that can be
configured to make good power reasonably to satisfy most needs.
Now, that being said, it's hard to argue when you go to a car show/large
swap meet, and you see trailer loads of wreck/take out LS1 engines+OD trans
that make good power, are very reasonably priced, and require little to put
in other than figuring out the mounts and how to hook the computer up with
the appropriate sensors.
With that in mind, I saw something this weekend at the Daytona Turkey Rod
Run that I think is a great alternative to using GM power. Use a late model
Hemi! I saw a 4000 mile 5.7L engine+auto trans w/computer/sensors/wiring
for about $3K. At least it's in the family, or you can make that argument
anyway. Plus, that's in the range of what it would take to build a good AMC
engine at today's prices.
The Mopar Hemi's are getting plentiful in the junkyard - at least the 5.7's.
The 6.1L - 425 HP versions are still scarce and pricey, but for a driver,
the smaller one would surely liven up an American. It would offer power,
reliability, driveability, and wouldn't be a GM! So, if you must do a swap,
then think about using this combo.
Just a thought from my overactive mind...
Jim Boone
Mims, FL
_________________________________________________________________
Get FREE company branded e-mail accounts and business Web site from
Microsoft Office Live
http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/mcrssaub0050001411mrt/direct/01/
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2006 11:08:51 -0500 (EST)
From: adh@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx (Sandwich Maker)
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] American rear end?
To: mail@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <200611271608.kARG8p412362@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
" From: Mark Price <markprice242@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
"
" I just stumbled on a made of unobtanium GM S series two wheel drive
" 3.42 geared 8.5" rear axle. Shipped it will cost me $400 even. It's a
" 34,000 mile axle shipped from a yard with no brakes except possible
" backing plates that could be either drum or disc.
" I'm trying to decide if this is a good move? The axle is 54" wide
" and will allow 1" wheel adapters or spacers to go to 4.5" bolt pattern.
" I have been considering using the S series as I like the vented
" aluminum calipered rear discs they use. Being able to get the 3.42 gear
" in the 8.5" axle is a big bonus. So I'm wondering if I am being wise to
" go this route??? Just how good is the 8.5" axle? I know it will look
" right under the car as it resembles the AMC15.
" With the 2.95 geared World class Cobra spec trans installed and this
" rear axle I would think I would be at a relatively safe point for the
" driveline to be matched up with no real weak links left?
" Help me think this one thru guys!
i don't follow the gm boards so i don't know how it's regarded
generally, but it definitely isn't as strong as a dana 44 - that was a
sought after camaro/firebird swap in the late '80s.
________________________________________________________________________
Andrew Hay the genius nature
internet rambler is to see what all have seen
adh@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx and think what none thought
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2006 11:26:42 -0500
From: AMC74Hornet@xxxxxxxxx (Mr. AMC)
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] AMC Progress (Parts Availability)
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <24429-456B11C2-15610@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII
On parts availability I needed a rear brake body to rear end rubber
brake hose for a 79 Concord and told it was not available. But the hose
for my 74 Hornet was available. They are slightly different and the 74
hose with some minor mounting bracket bending can be made to fit.
"Doc"
------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2006 16:28:57 +0000
From: msproviero@xxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] American rear end?
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID:
<112720061628.28187.456B124900070E8100006E1B2207300793019D0A0790019D9F9C03@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain
If what he's describing is a 10-bolt, I believe 3.42 is a fairly common ratio in 10-bolts from GM trucks.
-Spro
-------------- Original message --------------
From: adh@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx (Sandwich Maker)
> " From: Mark Price
> "
> " I just stumbled on a made of unobtanium GM S series two wheel drive
> " 3.42 geared 8.5" rear axle. Shipped it will cost me $400 even. It's a
> " 34,000 mile axle shipped from a yard with no brakes except possible
> " backing plates that could be either drum or disc.
> " I'm trying to decide if this is a good move? The axle is 54" wide
> " and will allow 1" wheel adapters or spacers to go to 4.5" bolt pattern.
> " I have been considering using the S series as I like the vented
> " aluminum calipered rear discs they use. Being able to get the 3.42 gear
> " in the 8.5" axle is a big bonus. So I'm wondering if I am being wise to
> " go this route??? Just how good is the 8.5" axle? I know it will look
> " right under the car as it resembles the AMC15.
> " With the 2.95 geared World class Cobra spec trans installed and this
> " rear axle I would think I would be at a relatively safe point for the
> " driveline to be matched up with no real weak links left?
> " Help me think this one thru guys!
>
> i don't follow the gm boards so i don't know how it's regarded
> generally, but it definitely isn't as strong as a dana 44 - that was a
> sought after camaro/firebird swap in the late '80s.
> ________________________________________________________________________
> Andrew Hay the genius nature
> internet rambler is to see what all have seen
> adh@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx and think what none thought
> _______________________________________________
> AMC-List mailing list
> AMC-List@xxxxxxxxxxxx
> http://www.amc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/amc-list
>
> or go to http://www.amc-list.com
------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2006 9:10:10 -0800
From: Mark Price <markprice242@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] American rear end?
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <24744761.1164647410391.JavaMail.root@web40>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
It's the 8.5 inch 10 bolt.
The 3.42 is a common ratio, but not in a 2 wheel drive S10 housing setup and ready to go. The common S10 10 bolt is 7.6" ring not the 8.5" The 8.5" 10 bolts only went in some of the V-6 5 speed or the ZR2 models. The ZR2 rear axle is about 65" wide though compared to 54" for the 2 wheel drive rear ends.
I think I'm going to pass on it. I've got too much stuff gathering dust already.
I've not got a clue when I will actually feel up to working on the thing either.
--
Mark Price
markprice242ATadelphia.net
Morgantown, WV
---- msproviero@xxxxxxxxxxx wrote:
> If what he's describing is a 10-bolt, I believe 3.42 is a fairly common ratio in 10-bolts from GM trucks.
>
> -Spro
>
> -------------- Original message --------------
> From: adh@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx (Sandwich Maker)
>
> > " From: Mark Price
> > "
> > " I just stumbled on a made of unobtanium GM S series two wheel drive
> > " 3.42 geared 8.5" rear axle. Shipped it will cost me $400 even. It's a
> > " 34,000 mile axle shipped from a yard with no brakes except possible
> > " backing plates that could be either drum or disc.
> > " I'm trying to decide if this is a good move? The axle is 54" wide
> > " and will allow 1" wheel adapters or spacers to go to 4.5" bolt pattern.
> > " I have been considering using the S series as I like the vented
> > " aluminum calipered rear discs they use. Being able to get the 3.42 gear
> > " in the 8.5" axle is a big bonus. So I'm wondering if I am being wise to
> > " go this route??? Just how good is the 8.5" axle? I know it will look
> > " right under the car as it resembles the AMC15.
> > " With the 2.95 geared World class Cobra spec trans installed and this
> > " rear axle I would think I would be at a relatively safe point for the
> > " driveline to be matched up with no real weak links left?
> > " Help me think this one thru guys!
> >
> > i don't follow the gm boards so i don't know how it's regarded
> > generally, but it definitely isn't as strong as a dana 44 - that was a
> > sought after camaro/firebird swap in the late '80s.
> > ________________________________________________________________________
> > Andrew Hay the genius nature
> > internet rambler is to see what all have seen
> > adh@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx and think what none thought
> > _______________________________________________
> > AMC-List mailing list
> > AMC-List@xxxxxxxxxxxx
> > http://www.amc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/amc-list
> >
> > or go to http://www.amc-list.com
> _______________________________________________
> AMC-List mailing list
> AMC-List@xxxxxxxxxxxx
> http://www.amc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/amc-list
>
> or go to http://www.amc-list.com
------------------------------
Message: 6
Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2006 9:13:27 -0800
From: Mark Price <markprice242@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] Blasphemy
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Cc: Jim Boone <fljab@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Message-ID: <26579914.1164647607036.JavaMail.root@web40>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
Theres already a Javelin going together in Vegas with a Hemi in it.
It's posted over on the AMCForums. I think you can find it under projects.
--
Mark Price
markprice242ATadelphia.net
Morgantown, WV
---- Jim Boone <fljab@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> Non-AMC powered cars has been and still is a subject that brings out very
> vocal opinions. It's been discussed here on the list at length at different
> times, usually with great debate. AMO a couple of yrs ago finally voted in
> a non-AMC powered class for shows.
>
> I have always been of the opinion that there really is no good-enough reason
> to put a Cheby engine (the usual choice) in your AMC (or Ford, Mopar, etc).
> There are still plenty of good engines - esp. 360's - out there that can be
> configured to make good power reasonably to satisfy most needs.
>
> Now, that being said, it's hard to argue when you go to a car show/large
> swap meet, and you see trailer loads of wreck/take out LS1 engines+OD trans
> that make good power, are very reasonably priced, and require little to put
> in other than figuring out the mounts and how to hook the computer up with
> the appropriate sensors.
>
> With that in mind, I saw something this weekend at the Daytona Turkey Rod
> Run that I think is a great alternative to using GM power. Use a late model
> Hemi! I saw a 4000 mile 5.7L engine+auto trans w/computer/sensors/wiring
> for about $3K. At least it's in the family, or you can make that argument
> anyway. Plus, that's in the range of what it would take to build a good AMC
> engine at today's prices.
>
> The Mopar Hemi's are getting plentiful in the junkyard - at least the 5.7's.
> The 6.1L - 425 HP versions are still scarce and pricey, but for a driver,
> the smaller one would surely liven up an American. It would offer power,
> reliability, driveability, and wouldn't be a GM! So, if you must do a swap,
> then think about using this combo.
>
> Just a thought from my overactive mind...
>
> Jim Boone
> Mims, FL
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Get FREE company branded e-mail accounts and business Web site from
> Microsoft Office Live
> http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/mcrssaub0050001411mrt/direct/01/
>
> _______________________________________________
> AMC-List mailing list
> AMC-List@xxxxxxxxxxxx
> http://www.amc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/amc-list
>
> or go to http://www.amc-list.com
------------------------------
Message: 7
Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2006 22:28:11 +0500
From: "ROSS BLAIR" <bigbad69@xxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] Blasphemy
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <20061127172815.B0B5C1158CD@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
<snip>
The Mopar Hemi's are getting plentiful in the junkyard - at least the 5.7's.
The 6.1L - 425 HP versions are still scarce and pricey, but for a driver, the smaller one would surely liven up an American. It would offer power,reliability, driveability, and wouldn't be a GM! So, if you must do a swap,then think about using this combo.
Just a thought from my overactive mind...
Jim Boone
Mims, FL
<snip>
Richard Payne in Las Vegas is doing a 5.7 Hemi swap to a '72 Javelin he rescued from the crusher. For those who don't frequent Brandon's AMC Forum, the project has been chronicled in a 7 page thread. It is very modified and should be quite the screamer once it's finished.
http://www.amcforums.com/cgi/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1119625822
Ross Blair
69 BBO Javelin 390
Ottawa, Ont.
--
Search for products and services at:
http://search.mail.com
------------------------------
Message: 8
Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2006 09:29:44 -0800 (PST)
From: Tom Jennings <tomj@xxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] Continuing Saga of Doc the Jeep, Part II.5
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.64.0611270857440.28102@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
On Mon, 27 Nov 2006, Nick Lenarz wrote:
> Some of you may recall the problem I've been having with my Jeep, under
> the heading "Weird non-running issue, '82 Jeep CJ". Things are
> better... sorta.
First, you have too many variables. Changing too many things at
a time makes it hard to sort out cause and effect. Disconnect
vacuum advance until you untangle things. The engine will
run fine, but will lower highway cruise fuel economy, and run
slightly warmer at idle. But you'll eliminate one variable.
Does distributor mechanical advance work? From idle to 3000
rpm, advance should increase 10 - 20 degrees BTDC (depending on
distributor). It should be a smooth change with RPM, and hold
steady. If not it's busted, and a major problem. Measure with
vacuum disconnected!
If above is working, damn right it'll ping under load, with 26
degrees static timing!
Your engine should run smoothly with 4 - 10 BDTC. Might not
make optimum power etc but it should idle smooth and accellerate
smoothly. Factory settings gaurentee that much.
There is Some Number of maximum degrees of advance for a given
engine and state of tune. For AMC and Chevy V8's, its about 36
degrees total advance -- static setting plus centrifugal advance
-- with vacuum disconnected. For the AMC six it's somewhat less
(30 - 34?) but works exactly the same way. (Some factory
distributors do a lot less than this.)
> If my hypothesis is correct, the spark timing HAS to be advanced
> (rather, is required to be) BECAUSE the valve timing is advanced, in
> order to find that 'sweet spot' where combustion and vacuum is best.
Nope. Ignition timing will vary somewhat with camming, but it
doesn't change the game. More than 32 - 36 degrees of advance,
ping. That's physics.
The cam you have will determine idle/cruise vacuum (I take it
you have a non-standard cam in there), if it's wildly wrong,
you can't fix it with spark timing.
------------------------------
Message: 9
Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2006 09:34:29 -0800 (PST)
From: Tom Jennings <tomj@xxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] Blasphemy
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.64.0611270932080.28102@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
On Mon, 27 Nov 2006, Jim Boone wrote:
> Non-AMC powered cars has been and still is a subject that brings out very
> vocal opinions.
Agreed.
> At least it's in the family, or you can make that argument
> anyway.
At least it's not as freakin' BORING!!! Sheesh -- if someone
stuck a flathead ford in an old Nash, or a Ford inline six in
an American, or a Porshe engine in a Spirit, it would at least
show some creativity and initiative. 350's are dull, dull,
dull. Fine motor, but common as white bread at walfarts.
------------------------------
Message: 10
Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2006 10:21:16 -0800 (PST)
From: Steven Clark <javelin1973401@xxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] ebay jav #1 amc dealer in america
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <20061127182116.26462.qmail@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
Hello, I've been lurking, I scanned this in a few
years ago as a way to contribute to the AMC community.
The copyright was a way to try to prevent folks from
doing a copy/paste and making money off it. I still
get emails with updates from time to time, and post
the updated info on my site. I don't mind if its
copied, posted on other sites, or what-not.
Steven Clark
-----
>>Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2006 13:45:23 -0800
From: "RetroRalph" <retroralph@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] ebay jav #1 amc dealer in
america
To: <amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Message-ID: <001201c710db$02f56f70$6400a8c0@ralphs1>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed;
charset=iso-8859-1;
reply-type=original
Isn't that the same thing that is shown here?
http://homepages.ius.edu/steven/amc/dealer/index.htm
I guess they are still giving Steven Clark credit for
this.. He did
this as
a project when he was in school as I recall. I kept a
link to his page
here. He had posted this info the the AMC-List.
See the old posting I pasted on below...
Chances are this is just frozen in time at the Indiana
University
server.
One can either set up a link to it or else just
download it and post it
giving him credit for it. I wonder if Steven Clark is
still with us on
the
AMC-List. He was quite active at that time. I think
he was working on
a
1973 Javelin..
----------------------------------------------
Here I found his old posting on this project...
" |\ From:: Steven Clark javelin1973401@xxxxxxxxx
Subject: AMC Jeep Renault Dealer Directory online
Date: Tue, 8 Jan 2002 17:18:00
Hello Everyone,
When I bought my 83 sx/4 the seller gave me all sorts
of neat AMC stuff with it. One of them was an AMC
Jeep Renault Dealer Directory. I have put the
directory online. If you would like to check it out
just follow this link:
http://homepages.ius.edu/steven/amc/dealer/index.htm
So far I have only put the US on it, I plan to add
Canada soon and
perhaps
Mexico if there is any interest. Feel free to email me
any
comments,criticisms, corrections, or anything else.
Thanks Steven Clark"
____________________________________________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail beta.
http://new.mail.yahoo.com
------------------------------
Message: 11
Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2006 11:56:19 -0800 (PST)
From: Tom Jennings <tomj@xxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] ebay jav #1 amc dealer in america
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.64.0611271150420.28102@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
On Mon, 27 Nov 2006, Steven Clark wrote:
> Hello, I've been lurking, I scanned this in a few
> years ago as a way to contribute to the AMC community.
> The copyright was a way to try to prevent folks from
> doing a copy/paste and making money off it. I still
> get emails with updates from time to time, and post
> the updated info on my site. I don't mind if its
> copied, posted on other sites, or what-not.
It's a great work!
I can look around for an appropriate copyright boilerplate if
you like, one that would acknowledge you as the compiler, allow
community sharing and updating, and prevent commercial parasites.
------------------------------
Message: 12
Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2006 14:41:26 -0800 (PST)
From: J Johnson <imfatdad@xxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [AMC-List] '65 American For Sale
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <39414.34821.qm@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
Regretably, have to sell my car. 65 American convert. I am second
owner, garage kept entire life. Car is in great condition and is a
very nice driver. Will be taking more pics in next few days. An older
pic here:
http://www.freewebs.com/amcofmemphis/jamesamerican.jpg
I have since acquired the missing side trim (at the very rear) and also
have wire wheel covers for it. 232 auto. interior is in suburb
condition. new top. Only current flaws are the speedo clicks some and
the radio does not function.
Please pass around info if you know someone looking for a very nice
fairly uncommon car.
I seek $7500- for the car.
thanks in advance.
OK, flame away!!!!
____________________________________________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail beta.
http://new.mail.yahoo.com
------------------------------
Message: 13
Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2006 20:41:53 -0500 (EST)
From: adh@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx (Sandwich Maker)
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] ebay jav #1 amc dealer in america
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <200611280141.kAS1frQ16940@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
" From: Tom Jennings <tomj@xxxxxxx>
"
" On Mon, 27 Nov 2006, Steven Clark wrote:
"
" > Hello, I've been lurking, I scanned this in a few
" > years ago as a way to contribute to the AMC community.
" > The copyright was a way to try to prevent folks from
" > doing a copy/paste and making money off it. I still
" > get emails with updates from time to time, and post
" > the updated info on my site. I don't mind if its
" > copied, posted on other sites, or what-not.
"
" It's a great work!
"
" I can look around for an appropriate copyright boilerplate if
" you like, one that would acknowledge you as the compiler, allow
" community sharing and updating, and prevent commercial parasites.
something like the gnu copyleft? that might be too restrictive, but
it's the right general direction.
________________________________________________________________________
Andrew Hay the genius nature
internet rambler is to see what all have seen
adh@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx and think what none thought
------------------------------
_______________________________________________
AMC-List mailing list
AMC-List@xxxxxxxxxxxx
http://www.amc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/amc-list
End of AMC-List Digest, Vol 10, Issue 54
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