AMC-List Digest, Vol 6, Issue 12
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AMC-List Digest, Vol 6, Issue 12
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- Date: Fri, 07 Jul 2006 06:39:49 +0000
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Today's Topics:
1. I shouldn't have done it... (Jim Boone)
2. Re: oil filters (Glen Hoag)
3. Re: I shouldn't Have Done It (JOE FULTON)
4. Re: Band adjustment, little aluminum Borg Warner auto
(Tom Jennings)
5. Re: Band adjustment, little aluminum Borg Warner auto
(Tom Jennings)
6. Re: Band adjustment, little aluminum Borg Warner auto
(Tom Jennings)
7. Re: oil filters (Tom Jennings)
8. Re: Band adjustment, little aluminum Borg Warner auto
(Sandwich Maker)
9. Cloth seat material (Jim Boone)
10. Re: cloth interiors (Eddie Stakes)
11. Re: Band adjustment, little aluminum Borg Warner auto
(Tom Jennings)
12. I shouldn't have done it... (francis.swygert@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx)
13. Re: Band adjustment, little aluminum Borg Warner auto
(francis.swygert@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx)
14. wanted / 68-70 pass side 1/4 panel (joey mercado)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Thu, 06 Jul 2006 17:25:34 -0400
From: "Jim Boone" <fljab@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [AMC-List] I shouldn't have done it...
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <BAY116-F121D88FFD91782D2F9C6E1AC770@xxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
I bought another AMC.
Couldn't help myself, I think I have a problem. Wife isn't talking to me,
seems to think I have too many already. Guess I need to sell something.
If any of you watch Ebay regularly, I bought the '72 Matador Wagon near
Philly (in NJ). Bid stayed low, it'll be $1700 plus expenses to get it
here which I'm still sorting it out. Shipping quotes so far upwards of
$900; I can fly up and drive back for half that on the outside. I have
in-laws near Dover, DE (Frank, when are you coming back?), so can stop there
first night and sort things out if need be.
I've been wanting to convert my '67 Wagon over to V8 auto, and have talked
about it on the list. This car is cleaner than mine, is an early Matador
which I like, and is a 258 auto.
More later...
Jim Boone
Mims, FL
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2006 16:35:03 -0500
From: Glen Hoag <hoag@xxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] oil filters
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <a06230901c0d2f2b0f123@[192.168.123.144]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed"
Which offshore company would that be?
Fram is currently a unit of Honeywell, Inc, which merged with
AlliedSignal at the end of 1999. Honeywell is an old line American
company with global operations, with its headquarters in Morris
Township, NJ. The Fram unit is based in Danbury, CT, along with the
Prestone brand, which AlliedSignal acquired from Union Carbide in
1985.
--Glen
>Fram filters used to be good. Since the offshore company has taken them
>over, quality went in the toilet. Guess I didn't get that across before.
>Take one of your stockpiled PH11s and open it (after you use it) and compare
>it to a new one (with the rubber dipped end. Quick way to tell if you have
>old stock or the new ^%%##@* one)
>
>
>From: russ hathaway <russh97309@xxxxxxxxx>
>Subject: [AMC-List] oil filters
>To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
>Message-ID:
><20060705203124.47491.qmail@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
>
>you will see all sorts of "tests" by people
>bad-mouthing the Frams, and I don't know why. Perhaps
>the original tester had a bone to pick with Fram,
>maybe a disgruntled employee, I don't know. I do know
>that I have been running Fram PH-11 in all my AMCs for
>years. I have never lost an engine, either 6 or 8, and
>start up chatter is non-existant. Of course I follow
>several time tested must-dos;
>-change oil and filter every 3k miles.
>-use a quality detergent oil. I run basically
>Valvoline 10-40 unless conditions call for something
>else.
>-Extreme use require modofications to your engine, do
>so and don't scrimp.
>-I flush out my engine with every change using
>Risoline and following directions.
> I am not against using other brands, and used
>Frams even when I was racing my Gremlin. But Fram has
>served me well and I have a shelf full of them. Let
>the argument begin......Russ
>
>_________________________________________________________________
>Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today - it's FREE!
>http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/
>
>_______________________________________________
>AMC-List mailing list
>AMC-List@xxxxxxxxxxxx
>http://www.amc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/amc-list
>
>or go to http://www.amc-list.com
--
Glen Hoag '75 Pacer 258 (x3)
hoag@xxxxxx '76 Pacer 258 (for parts)
Limestone County, Alabama '77 Pacer 258 (for kids)
'80 Pacer 258 DL wagon
'81 Concord DL 258
AMO #7895 AMCPC #471 '82 Spirit 151
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2006 16:09:22 -0700 (PDT)
From: JOE FULTON <piper_pa20@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] I shouldn't Have Done It
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <20060706230922.21366.qmail@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
Yeah Jim, I know the feeling, except I live alone and
don't have anyone to condemn me for buying another
car.
Congratulations on your purchase.
I have purchased two more station wagons which are
currently sitting in the Nevada desert. I hope to go
after one of them next weekend and the other one in a
couple of weeks after that. I'm right now trying to
put a Gremlin back on the road and get it out of the
back yard so I have room for one of the wagons.
I have my 80 Spirit for sale but so far not much
interest. $600 anyone?
The first wagon, a 63 Classic 770 with bucket seats
and console, (and aluminum 196) I will try to put back
on the road. The second, a 64 660 wagon I will
probably part out.
Joe Fulton
Salinas, CA
------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2006 17:42:18 -0700 (PDT)
From: Tom Jennings <tomj@xxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] Band adjustment, little aluminum Borg Warner
auto
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.64.0607061738400.18260@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
On Thu, 6 Jul 2006, Ken Ames wrote:
> A few of mine have a similar symptom. If you let them idle in neutral for a few
> moments after startup and before moving, they won't slip while building pressure
If I keep it filled precisely to the mark, it's fine, meaning
the delay before engaging, after sitting for a week or two, is
about 1 second the first time. If fluid is low, it can be 3 -
4 seconds. The older BWs are VERY sensitive to fluid level.
> Other trannys of the same model don't need this.
> Must be an internal leakdown of some sort.
> I've heard that prolonged idling in park isn't good for the Chryco
> transmissions, better to do it in neutral as there is better oilflow and the
> above seems to bear that out.
I wouldn't be surprised. I've had really good luck with this
trans, even though it's small, air-cooled, and in a largeish car
(Classic wagon).
------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2006 17:44:17 -0700 (PDT)
From: Tom Jennings <tomj@xxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] Band adjustment, little aluminum Borg Warner
auto
Cc: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.64.0607061742330.18260@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
On Thu, 6 Jul 2006, Mark Price wrote:
> I'd be careful of doing the band adjustment. It can be tricky as the threads on the adjustment and in the case can get corroded and just generally gunked up over years of road use. Then when you try to adjust it using the torque wrench method you can't get a good reading.
> Isn't the shop that did yours still in business? It's best with those to get someone who has done one before. If you can get it adjusted right I'd suggest doing so, but I don't know that I'd try it myself if I wasn't having problems.
The rear band's adjuster is external, so I can see it gettin
crapped up, and fouling up the torque reading... then maybe
I'll just leave it alone and fix the leak.
The place that adjusted it last, installed the pan with the
massive leak. I'd rather do that myself. I'll take the time
to do it right.
------------------------------
Message: 6
Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2006 17:46:35 -0700 (PDT)
From: Tom Jennings <tomj@xxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] Band adjustment, little aluminum Borg Warner
auto
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.64.0607061744400.18260@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
On Thu, 6 Jul 2006, Sandwich Maker wrote:
> you'd better take your old filter and gasket with you to the store.
Store? I've had really bad luck finding old-car parts retail here
in Los Angeles. I mail order stuff like this. I bought the Wix
kit from RockAuto, $11 including shipping; the "more info" app
is for all the aluminum trannies, so I'll take my chances there.
YOu're right, it's the m35 I have.
------------------------------
Message: 7
Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2006 17:54:36 -0700 (PDT)
From: Tom Jennings <tomj@xxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] oil filters
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.64.0607061747220.18260@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
> >you will see all sorts of "tests" by people
> >bad-mouthing the Frams, and I don't know why. Perhaps
> >the original tester had a bone to pick with Fram,
> >maybe a disgruntled employee, I don't know. I do know
> >that I have been running Fram PH-11 in all my AMCs for
> >years. I have never lost an engine, either 6 or 8, and
> >start up chatter is non-existant. Of course I follow
It's a fact that today, Fram filters have a glued-on carboard
end. Good ones use steel or molded plastic and retainers.
You could very well be having filter failures and never know it;
if the end pops off, oil would flow just fine, but not filter,
since you do excellent maintenance you'd never notice short of
opening up the filter.
Chances are, no brand filter fails often at all. But in the
"race to the bottom" in price (quality follows) these days it
pays to look ahead and step out of the way of future problems,
especially when the cost to avoid 'em is low.
------------------------------
Message: 8
Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2006 21:03:40 -0400 (EDT)
From: adh@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx (Sandwich Maker)
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] Band adjustment, little aluminum Borg Warner
auto
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <200607070103.k6713eX15695@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
" From: Tom Jennings <tomj@xxxxxxx>
"
" On Thu, 6 Jul 2006, Ken Ames wrote:
"
"
" > Other trannys of the same model don't need this.
" > Must be an internal leakdown of some sort.
" > I've heard that prolonged idling in park isn't good for the Chryco
" > transmissions, better to do it in neutral as there is better oilflow and the
" > above seems to bear that out.
"
" I wouldn't be surprised. I've had really good luck with this
" trans, even though it's small, air-cooled, and in a largeish car
" (Classic wagon).
otoh it can't be -that- 'largeish' if a 199 will motivate it
adequately, automatic and all!
________________________________________________________________________
Andrew Hay the genius nature
internet rambler is to see what all have seen
adh@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx and think what none thought
------------------------------
Message: 9
Date: Thu, 06 Jul 2006 21:35:20 -0400
From: "Jim Boone" <fljab@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [AMC-List] Cloth seat material
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <BAY116-F102EB3E5D9EA3C44818637AC740@xxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
Does anyone know where I can find information on what cloth material for the
seats was available in 1972?
Already figuring the first mod for the Mat Wagon. I've sent SMS Fabrics an
email to see if they know. I want an accurate pattern for that yr. Florida
cars need cloth seats and A/C.
Thanks,
Jim Boone
Mims, FL
------------------------------
Message: 10
Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2006 23:41:41 -0500
From: "Eddie Stakes" <eddiestakes@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] cloth interiors
To: "AMC List" <mail@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Message-ID: <041401c6a17f$aaa02ba0$28f1b148@piageedc1iqa5q>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
reply-type=original
Jim click here:
http://www.planethoustonamx.com/main/amc_production_figures.htm
and scroll down to interiors.
While it might be expensive to get ay, original corderoy for your Matty
wagon, something you can do is check with local upholstery shops, who armed
with a photo or pattern, could get really close to original looking.
Eddie Stakes'
Planet Houston AMX
713.464.8825
eddiestakes@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
*email is currently HEAVY
Call if important*
www.planethoustonamx.com
------------------------------
Message: 11
Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2006 21:47:07 -0700 (PDT)
From: Tom Jennings <tomj@xxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] Band adjustment, little aluminum Borg Warner
auto
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.64.0607062124420.18260@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
On Thu, 6 Jul 2006, Sandwich Maker wrote:
> " I wouldn't be surprised. I've had really good luck with this
> " trans, even though it's small, air-cooled, and in a largeish car
> " (Classic wagon).
>
> otoh it can't be -that- 'largeish' if a 199 will motivate it
> adequately, automatic and all!
Explain, "adequately".... !
My 1963 Rambler Classic wagon is slow! And it's not just the
propane conversion (probably cost me 15 hp max), it's just not
a lot of HP, and it's a 3.31 rear.
My Rambler came from Len's AMC Auto Wrecker in San Jose,
October 1988. Pulled of the top of a pile of cars headed for
the crusher. $300. It had an aluminum 196.5ci six, 3-speed
manual column shift trans. I had them yank the motor, and I
towed it home behind my 232-powered Hornet (a terrible idea,
but I was not killed).
I somehow wrestled a 232 into it. Guess what, motor didn't
fit stock x-member. (Recall this is pre-internet and for me,
pre-AMC-club, even.) Kyle at (cannot remember name of AMC parts
place in San Jose, long gone now) told me I needed the 64-up
x-member. Took Caltrans down, and carried it back on the train.
Bought a custom-built T96+OD from an ex-AMC dealer Ed Stack
(I think his name was). $400, all new parts. Had big sprad
between 1st and 2nd, just great for 1st+OD. Stripped 1st gear
teeth off it cresting a very, very steep hill in San Francisco,
loaded with camping gear on the car's maiden (sic) voyage,
a few months later. Took trip anyways, 2nd and 3rd gear only.
(I think the idea was, the original 196.5ci six simply couldn't
produce enough torque to break a flimsy T96 transmission in
a 3200 lb car. The 232 apparently could. Did AMC ship 1964+
big cars with 232 and T96?)
Kyle's biz partner (can't think of his name) up near Sacramento,
was parting out a 65 Classic, I took the rearend and the M35
auto trans. Had the trans rebuild by B&E Transmissions in San
Fran, 1990. (That's the brain-surgeon quality place I wish I
had down here). A decade later, 1996, pinion shaft sheared on
San Fernando Road! At a stop light, no less. Rear end rebuilt
by Dad's Old Car Garage, Culver City, now closed. That cost me
$1500, but it has a NOS ring and pinion and new bearings.
Still driving on that rebuild! But about 6 - 7 fluid/filter
changes and half dozen band adjustments. I literally climb
mountains with this car, you can't believe the places I've
driven this rambler, loaded to the ... with camping gear. Over
10,000 feet, death valley in july, route 80 east to reno,
100 miles of dirt roads in NV and UT, stuck in deep sand in
jeep-ville going to remote hot springs. I even, once, climbed
mild rocks in the Monitor Valley in Nevada (that was foolish,
I had to crawl backwards a foot at a time to avoid sitting the
trans on the rocks).
If I had to choose between my shiny new Hornet and the Rambler,
I'd choose the old rambler any day.
------------------------------
Message: 12
Date: Fri, 7 Jul 2006 06:20:34 -0000
From: <francis.swygert@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [AMC-List] I shouldn't have done it...
To: <fljab@xxxxxxxxxxx>, <amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Message-ID:
<8B4C911BEBA5E24888E353FF362B9E7702E65FEE@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
But that puts you right back into doing a V-8 swap for towing! Maybe
this one has the tow package? If it has a 998 or 727 instead of a 904
trans it should be the HD version and okay for towing around FL anyway,
flat enough! Of course a 4.0L head and EFI, or better an EFI stroker,
would solve that problem!
I won't be getting back until after mid September. Will be lucky to
leave here by the 15th, figure it will be between 15-20th before I get
back. Looks like you'll just miss me! To bad, I enjoyed our last short
visit.
--- original message ----------------
Date: Thursday, July 6, 2006 04:25 PM
From: Jim Boone <fljab@xxxxxxxxxxx>
I bought another AMC.
Couldn't help myself, I think I have a problem. Wife isn't talking to
me,
seems to think I have too many already. Guess I need to sell
something.
If any of you watch Ebay regularly, I bought the '72 Matador Wagon near
Philly (in NJ). Bid stayed low, it'll be $1700 plus expenses to get it
here which I'm still sorting it out. Shipping quotes so far upwards of
$900; I can fly up and drive back for half that on the outside. I have
in-laws near Dover, DE (Frank, when are you coming back?), so can stop
there
first night and sort things out if need be.
I've been wanting to convert my '67 Wagon over to V8 auto, and have
talked
about it on the list. This car is cleaner than mine, is an early
Matador
which I like, and is a 258 auto.
------------------------------
Message: 13
Date: Fri, 7 Jul 2006 06:30:16 -0000
From: <francis.swygert@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] Band adjustment, little aluminum Borg Warner
auto
To: <tomj@xxxxxxx>, <amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Message-ID:
<8B4C911BEBA5E24888E353FF362B9E7702E65FEF@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
All the M-1x series have cast iron cases. Aluminum are M-4x and M-3x
series for rear drive -- I think the M-2x is a front drive model used in
some small English cars, but may be rear drive. I've seen a reference
for it somewhere but can't remember where now. Air cooled points to M-3x
(or T-35, the only one I know of ever designated with a "T"). For 63-65
would be a 35. I'm not positive if the M-37 is air cooled or has trans
fluid cooling, I've never had the opportunity to work on one, just the
35, a couple 4x, and a few 1x.
------------------------------
Message: 14
Date: Thu, 06 Jul 2006 13:56:06 -0400
From: joey mercado <joebx@xxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [AMC-List] wanted / 68-70 pass side 1/4 panel
To: amcrelay@xxxxxxxxxxxx
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