AMC-List Digest, Vol 6, Issue 11
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AMC-List Digest, Vol 6, Issue 11
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- Date: Thu, 06 Jul 2006 20:25:35 +0000
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Today's Topics:
1. Re: oil filters (Savage, Pete)
2. Re: oil filters (Mark Price)
3. AC Oil Filters (scramblr@xxxxxxxxxxx)
4. Re: T5 Installation Help (Mark Price)
5. Re: chilson show (Poncho7amx@xxxxxxx)
6. Re: oil filters (Jim Blair)
7. Re: Engine mount hassles (Jim Blair)
8. Re: chilson show (Wayne E LaMothe)
9. Re: oil filters (Tom Jennings)
10. Re: Engine mount hassles (Mark Price)
11. Band adjustment, little aluminum Borg Warner auto (Tom Jennings)
12. Re: Band adjustment, little aluminum Borg Warner auto (Ken Ames)
13. Re: Band adjustment, little aluminum Borg Warner auto (Mark Price)
14. Re: Band adjustment, little aluminum Borg Warner auto
(Sandwich Maker)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2006 09:30:12 -0400
From: "Savage, Pete" <PSavage@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] oil filters
To: <amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Message-ID:
<BD261180E6D35F4D9D32F3E44FD3D90103460670@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Folks,
Please find below a link to a site that contains the analysis results on filter
construction and manufacturer...
Peter
http://minimopar.knizefamily.net/oilfilterstudy.html
-----Original Message-----
From: amc-list-bounces@xxxxxxx [mailto:amc-list-bounces@xxxxxxx]On Behalf Of Jock J Jocewicz
Sent: Wednesday, July 05, 2006 7:40 PM
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] oil filters
My feelings on the Fram filters are that they are OK to use on a stock
or mild engine but over there years a lot of NAMDRA members have had
problems with Fram filters in their race cars or street/strip machines,
so I say steer clear of Fram filter in a modified AMC engine.
On Wed, 5 Jul 2006 13:31:24 -0700 (PDT) russ hathaway
<russh97309@xxxxxxxxx> writes:
> you will see all sorts of "tests" by people
> bad-mouthing the Frams, and I don't know why. Perhaps
> the original tester had a bone to pick with Fram,
> maybe a disgruntled employee, I don't know. I do know
> that I have been running Fram PH-11 in all my AMCs for
> years. I have never lost an engine, either 6 or 8, and
> start up chatter is non-existant. Of course I follow
> several time tested must-dos;
> -change oil and filter every 3k miles.
> -use a quality detergent oil. I run basically
> Valvoline 10-40 unless conditions call for something
> else.
> -Extreme use require modofications to your engine, do
> so and don't scrimp.
> -I flush out my engine with every change using
> Risoline and following directions.
> I am not against using other brands, and used
> Frams even when I was racing my Gremlin. But Fram has
> served me well and I have a shelf full of them. Let
> the argument begin......Russ
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
> http://mail.yahoo.com
> _______________________________________________
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>
> or go to http://www.amc-list.com
>
>
Jock Jocewicz - President/Editor NAMDRA NAMDRA@xxxxxxxx
8537 Antioch Rd., Salem, WI 53168 (262) 843-4326
JOIN NAMDRA, the best AMC club around!!!
'06 AMC NATIONALS - SEP. 14-16, 2006 - CORDOVA DRAGWAY PARK, CORDOVA, IL
AMO#19, NAMDRA#46, AMCRC#974, NHRA#41915, IHRA#6766
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------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2006 6:44:26 -0700
From: Mark Price <markprice242@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] oil filters
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Cc: "Savage, Pete" <PSavage@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Message-ID: <16755632.1152193466686.JavaMail.root@web16>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
Yeah, read the site. No conclusions, to each his own. This was beat to DEATH on the list a while back! The only thing I have to say is everytime I put a Fram on my Jeeps it leaks! Don't ask me why, I cdon't know Puralator and WIX don't. Just the Frams. Lesson learned, I don't buy Fram.
--
Mark Price
markprice242ATadelphia.net
Morgantown, WV
---- "Savage wrote:
> Folks,
>
> Please find below a link to a site that contains the analysis results on filter
> construction and manufacturer...
>
> Peter
>
>
> http://minimopar.knizefamily.net/oilfilterstudy.html
>
>
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2006 6:51:32 -0700
From: <scramblr@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [AMC-List] AC Oil Filters
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <1180172116.1152193892815.JavaMail.root@fepweb02>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
Don't know if they have quit making them but my warehouse shows 15 PF24 AC filters in stock. Let me know if you want any @5.25 each.
Don't forget,, filters only filter PART of the oil,, the part that goes through them. Under high flow conditions (cold or high pressure) the by-pass valve opens and lets oil BY PASS the filter. Another reason to use high quality oil and keep it clean.
But HEY,,, that's just ME!!
Bruce Hevner
------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2006 8:28:33 -0700
From: Mark Price <markprice242@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] T5 Installation Help
To: AMC-DelMarVA@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Cc: mail@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <33170586.1152199713708.JavaMail.root@web16>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
John,
I was cleaning out my email and came across this.
Any progress?
I have some new news. Just got off the phone with Bruce Coutier from Modern driveline. He says the tailhousings swaps are straightforward, yeah! Cause I just bought a Zcode spec 2.95 Ford trans that needs a cluster to put in my American!
330 ftlb torque capacity! Yeah I shouldn't break it! Anyway
Bruce says the only issue is the speedo drive point. What he does, depending on the trans and tailshaft is either just make a shim to mount the gear and drill it to use a the stock clip or, if things are tight he will bore the speedo gear out, turn the output shaft and make a shim to go in between. This keeps everything nice a concentric [SP?] so the speedo doesn't wobble. I think the turning and shimming is how he does all his refits as he doesn't want customer complaints if the speedo gear wears out every 5,000 miles or the speedo flutters from not running true.
Oh, if you need any Non world class 2.95 trans parts I have some I will likely sell off as soon as I get this trans built. I have a new cluster for a NWC 2.95 trans and a selection of new gears. I've toyes with the idea of building a 2.95 close ratio 4 speed trans with the leftovers, but I'm not sure I will as I doubt there would be any demand fro the beast once it was done.
It looks like it could be built easily with leftovers I have.
Would make a nice trans for a city dweller with a six cylinder car that doesn't use overdrive.
--
Mark Price
markprice242ATadelphia.net
Morgantown, WV
---- NOSIGMA@xxxxxxx wrote:
> I am finally going to install a T-5 behind the 258 6 in my American. I need
> some advice from those who have done this swap before (Mark & Garry).
>
> Parts on hand:
> Ford T-5, pn 18-52-034 from an 1983 SVO 5.0 V8. It has the right input
> shaft.
> Chevy S-10 T-5. I got this for the tailhousing so I can move the shifter
> forward and allow use of the bench seat.
> Ford T-5 crossmember, mounting isolator, speedometer cable.
> Current trans is a 150T attached to a T-4 multipattern bellhousing.
>
> Do any of you have some links to sites where the swap is identified or links
> to discussion boards (AMXfiles, AMCForum(still around?). I know all this
> has been discussed before, I just didnt keep copies of it.
>
> Questions:
> Which clutch, pressure plate, pilot bearing, release lever, throw out
> bearing did you use with the T-4 multipattern bellhousing?
>
> How did you adapt the speedo cable from T-5 to Rambler?
>
> Hints on crossmember, how did you do yours?
>
>
> Tailshaft conversion moves the speedometer drive gear to a spot where there
> is no drive gear on the output shaft. I know others have dealt with this but
> I dont know how. Any suggestions?
>
> John Young
> 66 Rambler Convertable,
> Ported 4.0 HO head, cam, roller rockers, big valves, 3-45 DCOE's
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>
>
> ################################################
> American Motors 1954-1987 - They backed them
> better because they built them better!
> ################################################
> Join one of the clubs, and help preserve the cars:
> American Motors Owners Association http://www.AMONational.com
> AMC Rambler Club http://www.AMCRC.com
> ################################################
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
> <*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AMC-DelMarVA/
>
> <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
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>
> <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>
------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2006 12:34:58 EDT
From: Poncho7amx@xxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] chilson show
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <51d.331958a.31de95b2@xxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
does any one no wut the date is for gordys show in lawrancevill p.a?
------------------------------
Message: 6
Date: Thu, 06 Jul 2006 09:37:56 -0700
From: "Jim Blair" <carnuck@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] oil filters
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <BAY114-F27E2A15D21A5396A61F584AC770@xxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
Fram filters used to be good. Since the offshore company has taken them
over, quality went in the toilet. Guess I didn't get that across before.
Take one of your stockpiled PH11s and open it (after you use it) and compare
it to a new one (with the rubber dipped end. Quick way to tell if you have
old stock or the new ^%%##@* one)
From: russ hathaway <russh97309@xxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [AMC-List] oil filters
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID:
<20060705203124.47491.qmail@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
you will see all sorts of "tests" by people
bad-mouthing the Frams, and I don't know why. Perhaps
the original tester had a bone to pick with Fram,
maybe a disgruntled employee, I don't know. I do know
that I have been running Fram PH-11 in all my AMCs for
years. I have never lost an engine, either 6 or 8, and
start up chatter is non-existant. Of course I follow
several time tested must-dos;
-change oil and filter every 3k miles.
-use a quality detergent oil. I run basically
Valvoline 10-40 unless conditions call for something
else.
-Extreme use require modofications to your engine, do
so and don't scrimp.
-I flush out my engine with every change using
Risoline and following directions.
I am not against using other brands, and used
Frams even when I was racing my Gremlin. But Fram has
served me well and I have a shelf full of them. Let
the argument begin......Russ
_________________________________________________________________
Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today - it's FREE!
http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/
------------------------------
Message: 7
Date: Thu, 06 Jul 2006 09:41:30 -0700
From: "Jim Blair" <carnuck@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] Engine mount hassles
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <BAY114-F10BB6B189B681494A7B2AAC770@xxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
A: In the past I have dropped the engine/trans with both the crossbars out
the bottom (when I had a lift and overhead hoist) Made working on them so
much nicer. Had to do the same with FWD '80s GM vehicles in order to change
the trans fast which is why I had the setup.
From: Mark Price <markprice242@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] Engine mount hassles
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <25054444.1152136259372.JavaMail.root@web24>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
Simple the engines and trans came in from underneath in one
piece!
--
Mark Price
markprice242ATadelphia.net
Morgantown, WV
_________________________________________________________________
Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today - it's FREE!
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------------------------------
Message: 8
Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2006 13:09:38 -0400
From: Wayne E LaMothe <superglider@xxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] chilson show
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <20060706.130938.3888.0.superglider@xxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
I believe it is labor day weekend. Not sure but that is when it was last
year and I think he said he would do it again this year. It used to be
the third weekend in September but he seems to be going with Labor Day
weekend now.
Wayne
Wayne & Lisa (Skeezix), Bolton Landing, NY,
http://www.superglider.thinkhost.com/
AMO#8454, 83 Eagle Limited Wagon, 82 SX/4, 258 auto
69 Ambo coupe, 401, M12, 66 Ambo 990 Wagon, 327,PW,PB,PS,posi,AM/FM,AC
88 Jeep J10 360, auto- a Real truck
2001 Cherokee, 2000 Chrysler Cirrus (both hers)
On Thu, 6 Jul 2006 12:34:58 EDT Poncho7amx@xxxxxxx writes:
> does any one no wut the date is for gordys show in lawrancevill
> p.a?
> _______________________________________________
> AMC-List mailing list
> AMC-List@xxxxxxxxxxxx
> http://www.amc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/amc-list
>
> or go to http://www.amc-list.com
>
>
------------------------------
Message: 9
Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2006 10:41:57 -0700 (PDT)
From: Tom Jennings <tomj@xxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] oil filters
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.64.0607061020300.18260@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
On Thu, 6 Jul 2006, Savage, Pete wrote:
> Please find below a link to a site that contains the analysis results on filter
> construction and manufacturer...
NO KIDDING!! That's a really great project he pulled off.
It also matches the more casual experiences I've heard here
and elsewhere; Fram sucks (poor construction) NAPA/Wix good.
I've been running Mobil1 (expensive, but I follow 'oil is cheaper
than engines'). I'll use NAPA/Wix for the oil change due this
week, but I may mailorder his preferred filter, Baldwin:
Baldwin B9 (AMC):
http://www.adiesel.com/prodinfo.php?sku=B9
------------------------------
Message: 10
Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2006 11:06:26 -0700
From: Mark Price <markprice242@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] Engine mount hassles
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Cc: Jim Blair <carnuck@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Message-ID: <4863259.1152209186934.JavaMail.root@web28>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
We did the 80's GM cars both ways. It seemed to take about the same amount of time to wrestle the engine out the top for and engine job as it took to drop the cradle. Some of us preferred one way, some the other, but no one got rich doing warranty work on 80's GM front drives!
Mark Price
markprice242ATadelphia.net
Morgantown, WV
---- Jim Blair <carnuck@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> A: In the past I have dropped the engine/trans with both the crossbars out
> the bottom (when I had a lift and overhead hoist) Made working on them so
> much nicer. Had to do the same with FWD '80s GM vehicles in order to change
> the trans fast which is why I had the setup.
>
>
> From: Mark Price <markprice242@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Subject: Re: [AMC-List] Engine mount hassles
> To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
> Message-ID: <25054444.1152136259372.JavaMail.root@web24>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
>
> Simple the engines and trans came in from underneath in one
> piece!
> --
> Mark Price
> markprice242ATadelphia.net
> Morgantown, WV
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today - it's FREE!
> http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/
>
> _______________________________________________
> AMC-List mailing list
> AMC-List@xxxxxxxxxxxx
> http://www.amc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/amc-list
>
> or go to http://www.amc-list.com
------------------------------
Message: 11
Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2006 11:58:03 -0700 (PDT)
From: Tom Jennings <tomj@xxxxxxx>
Subject: [AMC-List] Band adjustment, little aluminum Borg Warner auto
To: AMC List <mail@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.64.0607061140250.18260@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
My old Rambler's trannie has a pan leak, so I'll drain and
replace filter and gasket. But while I'm in there I probably
should adjust the bands. I have no experience with auto
transmissions, though I'm otherwise competent.
I have a TSM, and will buy an inch/lb torque wrench (have only
big ft/lb), but the front servo info is a bit vague -- do I have
to remove the valve body or internal throttle linkage parts to
get to it?
Other than the (pretty substantial) pan leak, the trans works
fine; no slippage or bad shifts. The only problems seem to be
caused by low fluid; slow to go into D1 or D2 after sitting for
a week. It'll leak out most of a pint in a month of sitting.
It was rebuilt a looong time ago (1990) but treated very,
very well (bi-annual fluid/filter change, adjustment).
Am I wasting my time thinking about adjustment? Changing the
filter seems a no-brainer since I'll have the pan off anyways.
Finding the right filter/gasket is a problem; I think my trans is
a 1965 M12 (it's been a long time), torque tube drive. rockauto
shows a WIX #58658, but the description in "more info" says
it's for a 727. Could be wrong "more info" or wrong part. I'll
keep looking.
------------------------------
Message: 12
Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2006 14:11:02 -0600
From: Ken Ames <ameskg@xxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] Band adjustment, little aluminum Borg Warner
auto
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <1152216662.44ad6e5631a3e@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
A few of mine have a similar symptom. If you let them idle in neutral for a few
moments after startup and before moving, they won't slip while building pressure
when you put them in drive. Other trannys of the same model don't need this.
Must be an internal leakdown of some sort.
I've heard that prolonged idling in park isn't good for the Chryco
transmissions, better to do it in neutral as there is better oilflow and the
above seems to bear that out.
Ken
Quoting Tom Jennings <tomj@xxxxxxx>:
The only problems seem to be
> caused by low fluid; slow to go into D1 or D2 after sitting for
> a week.
> _______________________________________________
> AMC-List mailing list
> AMC-List@xxxxxxxxxxxx
> http://www.amc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/amc-list
>
> or go to http://www.amc-list.com
>
------------------------------
Message: 13
Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2006 13:21:03 -0700
From: Mark Price <markprice242@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] Band adjustment, little aluminum Borg Warner
auto
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <8947148.1152217263673.JavaMail.root@web25>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
I'd be careful of doing the band adjustment. It can be tricky as the threads on the adjustment and in the case can get corroded and just generally gunked up over years of road use. Then when you try to adjust it using the torque wrench method you can't get a good reading.
Isn't the shop that did yours still in business? It's best with those to get someone who has done one before. If you can get it adjusted right I'd suggest doing so, but I don't know that I'd try it myself if I wasn't having problems.
--
Mark Price
markprice242ATadelphia.net
Morgantown, WV
---- Tom Jennings <tomj@xxxxxxx> wrote:
> My old Rambler's trannie has a pan leak, so I'll drain and
> replace filter and gasket. But while I'm in there I probably
> should adjust the bands. I have no experience with auto
> transmissions, though I'm otherwise competent.
>
> I have a TSM, and will buy an inch/lb torque wrench (have only
> big ft/lb), but the front servo info is a bit vague -- do I have
> to remove the valve body or internal throttle linkage parts to
> get to it?
>
> Other than the (pretty substantial) pan leak, the trans works
> fine; no slippage or bad shifts. The only problems seem to be
> caused by low fluid; slow to go into D1 or D2 after sitting for
> a week. It'll leak out most of a pint in a month of sitting.
> It was rebuilt a looong time ago (1990) but treated very,
> very well (bi-annual fluid/filter change, adjustment).
>
> Am I wasting my time thinking about adjustment? Changing the
> filter seems a no-brainer since I'll have the pan off anyways.
>
>
>
> Finding the right filter/gasket is a problem; I think my trans is
> a 1965 M12 (it's been a long time), torque tube drive. rockauto
> shows a WIX #58658, but the description in "more info" says
> it's for a 727. Could be wrong "more info" or wrong part. I'll
> keep looking.
>
> _______________________________________________
> AMC-List mailing list
> AMC-List@xxxxxxxxxxxx
> http://www.amc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/amc-list
>
> or go to http://www.amc-list.com
------------------------------
Message: 14
Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2006 16:25:21 -0400 (EDT)
From: adh@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx (Sandwich Maker)
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] Band adjustment, little aluminum Borg Warner
auto
To: mail@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <200607062025.k66KPLw14274@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
" From: Tom Jennings <tomj@xxxxxxx>
"
"
"
"
" Finding the right filter/gasket is a problem; I think my trans is
" a 1965 M12 (it's been a long time), torque tube drive. rockauto
" shows a WIX #58658, but the description in "more info" says
" it's for a 727. Could be wrong "more info" or wrong part. I'll
" keep looking.
the m12 is an -iron- warner of about '70; for '65 iirc the m10 would
be current -- but an aluminum warner would be an m35 [t35] or close
sibling. partsamerica is similarly confused about fitment - it asks
you which engine you have, then shows you the same 3 filter kits
regardless, and we know the m35 filter doesn't fit the m10/11/12. and
it also shows the iron warner crossref to early-'60s mopar... but not
to the fmx - but if you check ford, you find a '68-'77 fmx listing that
fits '67 amc 290s! and oddly, '67 amc 287s...
the torque tube shouldn't matter, but you should have a rear-pump
tranny and i don't know if the filter's different from a later
front-only version.
you'd better take your old filter and gasket with you to the store.
________________________________________________________________________
Andrew Hay the genius nature
internet rambler is to see what all have seen
adh@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx and think what none thought
------------------------------
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End of AMC-List Digest, Vol 6, Issue 11
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