AMC-List Digest, Vol 5, Issue 30
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AMC-List Digest, Vol 5, Issue 30
- From: amc-list-request@xxxxxxx
- Date: Wed, 14 Jun 2006 12:00:01 +0000
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Today's Topics:
1. Brake Conversion (CitywideTowing@xxxxxxx)
2. Re: my 62 classic project (Sandwich Maker)
3. Survivors etc... (Andy&Tonja&Phoebe Ray)
4. Re: my 62 classic project (Mark Price)
5. Re: Timing (EdForrest@xxxxxxx)
6. Interesting PCV fix/re-route for late V8's! Gates #21784 (Jesse)
7. T-5 comments (John Elle)
8. Re: my 62 classic project (francis.swygert@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx)
9. Re: Brake Conversion (francis.swygert@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx)
10. New Projects To Start Today (Mr. AMC)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Tue, 13 Jun 2006 21:00:48 EDT
From: CitywideTowing@xxxxxxx
Subject: [AMC-List] Brake Conversion
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <384.45ff3bb.31c0b9c0@xxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
I am trying to do a disc brake conversion , but am running into a problem .
The problem is it has been a while since I took the parts off the donor car
and have forgotten the order they go on in . Does the Caliper braket or the
backing plate or the spindle go first and what is second , From there I think I
can figure it out . Thank You in Advance as I seem to have lost all memory
and common sense in this issue
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Tue, 13 Jun 2006 21:04:16 -0400 (EDT)
From: adh@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx (Sandwich Maker)
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] my 62 classic project
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <200606140104.k5E14GZ04958@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
" From: Mark Price <markprice242@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
"
" I think the Jeep tailhousing will be too short to work for adapting to a torque tube. You will likely end up a good foot shorter than the torque tube tranny!
better too short than too long! plenty of room to machine a block
with the tailhousing pattern on one side and the torque tube pattern
on the other - and while we're at it, a tranny mount on the bottom and
speedo drive on the side...
i think the only showstopper would be if the mainshaft is way too
short. there are longish output yokes that can make up a few inches.
________________________________________________________________________
Andrew Hay the genius nature
internet rambler is to see what all have seen
adh@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx and think what none thought
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Tue, 13 Jun 2006 18:41:42 -0700
From: "Andy&Tonja&Phoebe Ray" <raysinvegas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [AMC-List] Survivors etc...
To: <amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Message-ID: <001201c68f53$b0e31f10$7060e404@yourwg5n33dutv>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
OK, third times a charm. I've been trying to post from the main page but I guess you can't do that anymore.
Ross, ANY and all AMC/Rambler/Jeep/Eagle/Nash/Hudson cars or trucks in ANY shape are encouraged to come!! I will be showing my driver Rampart Red 440H Twin-Stick that has paint you can rub off with your finger. I will also tow in my Javelin project if it isn't on the road by then. White primer and all! I believe "prostreetamx" is going to tow in his one-of-a-kind hand built Hemi Javelin G-machine. Everything on this car is custom and must be seen to be believed! I used to be afraid to show my American, but two years ago some club buddies convinced me to go for it. I had a blast! For most of the day I had the only 6cyl car on the field(local hot rod show). The show people treated me like I had a $50,000 trailer queen. My old American got tons of attention and compliments, most were happy to see an honest survivor as a work in progress. There are simply not many old(pre 80's) cars here in Las Vegas. Please just give her a bath and show away! We have a very nice bunch of c!
ar nuts in our club, people of all levels with cars of all levels, no one will do anything except make you feel welcome! The host Hotel is bending over backward for us too. It should be a GREAT time for anyone who wants to come! So, drive it, tow it or push it-- just come!
Andy Ray
Las Vegas NV
64 440H(3!)
68 Javelin SST 343
------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Tue, 13 Jun 2006 19:38:14 -0700
From: Mark Price <markprice242@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] my 62 classic project
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <12977728.1150252695085.JavaMail.root@web20>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
My thoughts are that being that far short would require a coupler/shaft between the trans and the driveshaft, complicating things. I guess you could use the Jeep tailhousing over a car T-5 output shaft and work things out from there. Still a lot of work to keep a torque tube.
--
Mark Price
markprice242ATadelphia.net
Morgantown, WV
---- Sandwich Maker <adh@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> " From: Mark Price <markprice242@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
> "
> " I think the Jeep tailhousing will be too short to work for adapting to a torque tube. You will likely end up a good foot shorter than the torque tube tranny!
>
> better too short than too long! plenty of room to machine a block
> with the tailhousing pattern on one side and the torque tube pattern
> on the other - and while we're at it, a tranny mount on the bottom and
> speedo drive on the side...
>
> i think the only showstopper would be if the mainshaft is way too
> short. there are longish output yokes that can make up a few inches.
> ________________________________________________________________________
> Andrew Hay the genius nature
> internet rambler is to see what all have seen
> adh@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx and think what none thought
> _______________________________________________
> AMC-List mailing list
> AMC-List@xxxxxxxxxxxx
> http://www.amc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/amc-list
>
> or go to http://www.amc-list.com
------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Tue, 13 Jun 2006 22:48:28 EDT
From: EdForrest@xxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] Timing
To: francis.swygert@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx, amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Cc: HProduction38@xxxxxxx
Message-ID: <4b6.2460cd4.31c0d2fc@xxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Frank...
Went back to Square One with this thing. Thanks for the suggestion...
We either have a crank pulley or a timing cover that is not matched. We
hand pushed the Number 1 to TDC...made a new mark on the crank pulley and
installed the distributor.
Yep...6=8!
Heading for Charlotte...SCCA is running Lowe's Speedway...should be lots of
fun.
All the best,
ed
1982 AMC Spirit-GT. American Road Race of Champions-November-2005
The Mazda's were not happy on this day!
-------------- next part --------------
Frank...
Went back to Square One with this thing. Thanks for the
suggestion...
We either have a crank pulley or a timing cover that is not
matched. We hand pushed the Number 1 to TDC...made a new mark on the crank pulley and installed the distributor.
Yep...6=8!
Heading for Charlotte...SCCA is running Lowe's Speedway...should be
lot
All the best,
ed
1982 AMC Spirit-GT. American R Champions-November-2005 [3D"cid:X.MA1.1150253304@aol=]
The Mazda's were not happy on this day!
-------------- next part --------------
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------------------------------
Message: 6
Date: Tue, 13 Jun 2006 22:22:23 -0700 (PDT)
From: Jesse <j2sax@xxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [AMC-List] Interesting PCV fix/re-route for late V8's! Gates
#21784
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <20060614052224.9752.qmail@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
Fade to past- I have been chasing down a series of oil
leaks that did not seem to end. First it was my fuel
pump gasket, then the valve cover, then the oil
pressure switch, and finally the intake which really
started POURING after a 70 MPH run. These on an 86
J10.
ANYWAY, the PCV valve always sounded and felt fine,
however, I thought I would check for vacuum leaks
(DON'T STOP READING IF YOU THINK YOU KNOW WHERE THIS
IS GOING!). Sure enough the air cleaner was AGAIN
filled with oil. Found that the vacuum hoses running
to the evap cannister were SHOT, both from the PCV and
the Carb bowl.
On AMC V8's the oil filler cap is the air filter for
your PCV intake. That's why you don't find the little
foam element in the air cleaner like the 258's and
many older cars have. After 20 years mine was SOLID
inside. I could still blow through it (do NOT try
sucking on it!) but when compared with the new one
(available through Dorman/Master at any parts store)
it was night and day. If you are still running your
AMC V8 OE oil cap, CHANGE IT!
I then discover that the hose to the intake (large)
side of the PCV was about 2 sizes too big and the
small one was corroded! The PCV system requires good
vacuum to operate properly and mine did NOT have it!
I am sure the reason for the mismatched hose was the
PO had so much trouble getting the PCV in position.
This applies to later model 360's, (older ones just
have the PCV sticking out of a rubber grommet in the
intake) but there is a TON of stuff between the intake
manifold tube and the carb base where the PCV hooks
up. There are two intake vacuum nipples, the EGR
valve, accel cable bracket and the PCV is longer than
the old style as it has an adapter for an Evap Can
vacuum line. No matter how you try to line up the
manifold tube and the carb inlet it is a ROYAL PAIN
and it is still difficult to get the hose on without
kinking or getting in the way of something else.
It appeared that by pointing the tube towards the
firewall, I could loop back around to the carb and get
around the obstacles as well as make it easier to get
to other hoses in back of the intake. The really
correct way to do this would be to replace the short
metal intake mani tube with a longer one that you
could bend towards the firewall, around the EGR and
point directly at the back of the carb. I did not have
time for bending tube and flaring ends. Trying to loop
the hoses was too tight and caused "kinkiness" (yes,
HAHA).
I went to O'Reilly's and they let me walk around to
ponder the formed hoses. Jerry (I told him I would
mention his name!) pointed out a little hose (Gates #
21784) that almost looked like a shallow "V" and was
the right size for the PCV. It was RIGHT ON THE MONEY!
I pointed the stock tube towards the driver's side of
the firewall and when I put the Gates hose on it
pointed almost directly at the back of the carb. There
was no strain anywhere in either hose and it really
cleans up the rear and psngr side of the intake. Try
it you'll like it!
Here's the whole process. At the psngr side rear of
the intake, gently, bungee the heater hose and wiring
harness up out of the way and disconnect the wires
from the heater box. I am sure it is easier with the
heater hose removed, but I did not have time for that.
First remove the intake tube (a short 3/4 open end
wrench will make it easier). My tube was stuck in the
fitting so I soaked it with Deep Creep and it was
loose in minutes. Once the tube is removed use a
15/16 socket to remove the brass fitting for the tube
at the manifold as it is probably loose and losing
vacuum. None of this is fun due to a lack of room ,
however, it is much easier putting this all back
together after the Mod, so don't get too discouraged
when you are struggling to remove it!
Clean the fitting inside and out then re-install with
some teflon tape. (not too tight... it is brass!) T
tape and then start the threads for the intake
manifold tube with the tube pointing off center
towards the drivers side of the firewall. As always
with compression fittings, you should have two
wrenches, one for the fitting (15/16) and one for the
tube (3/4... both wrenches the shorter the better!)
Before you completely tighten it down, trial fit
everything together. Tighten it up and you are ready
to go! Hope this helps.. my oil leaks are GONE, THANK
YOU LORD!
Do well... maybe I'll see you in Denver this weekend
as I put another 1500 miles on an 86 J10 rescued from
a barn! Asking a lot of a truck that was resurrected
after 8 years of sitting but after 14,000 miles of
trips to CO, Chicago, Kenosha, TX, etc... MOST of them
towing a car or Jeep there or back, I think I can say
she's used to it! I have never done anything but
change fluids and a caliper, so it's about time I get
down and actually maintain this blessing!
Jesse
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
------------------------------
Message: 7
Date: Tue, 13 Jun 2006 23:06:33 -0700
From: "John Elle" <johnelle@xxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [AMC-List] T-5 comments
To: mail@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <000601c68f78$b431fc20$ccdd0d82@john1>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
SNIP
afaik the '83-5 5.0 t-5 was rated 240 ft-lbs, a tick higher than the
jeep's 220 (ft lbs)
SNIP
The world class unit is rated around 325 to 300 ft lbs of torque. This
compares to the about 400 ft lbs of torque that a T-10 is rated at. This
is a significant increase over the lighter duty units used by Ford and
on the Jeep and AMC products.
SNIP
i think this has something to do with output torque as the 'stang 1st
is 2.95 vs. the jeep's 4.03.
SNIP
This is in part true although to what extent for this comparison I am
not sure and would require a bit more looking up. However the torque
rating of both transmissions can be improved by rebuilding them using a
taller 1st and 2nd gear ratio, something which could be advisable if you
plan on installing either unit in a vehicle with a rear axle ration in
the area of 3.54:1 or shorter. If you do not take into consideration the
final drive of the automobile involved you can spend a lot of money
installing a transmission that will then act like a pickem-up truck 4
speed with a totally unusable 1st gear often referred to as a grannie
low. This will leave you with a wide ratio 3 speed (starting off in 2nd)
and a steep overdrive. Unless you are building a rock crawler or
something similar I am sure this is not the intent one began with when
starting on a 5 speed project.
If you choose to leave the factory T5 gearing alone you are best off
using something on the order of a 3.15:1 rear axle or taller such as
something in the high twos.
SNIP
The 80's mustang world class trans where known for stripping off third
gear,
SNIP
This is generally resolved by installing a Hurst Shifter on this
transmission.
SNIP
it kinda dilutes the fun if you have to pussyfoot the tranny though,
and if you have to get one why not a later stronger unit?
SNIP
Well duh! If you gonna spend the money, why not find something worth
spending it on. The AMC 5 speed has it's place and I am sure that it can
be obtained cheap enough and you can make do with it on a low power
application. After all AMC did that for quite a few years, but the
better units are still out there at a reasonable price and once
installed stand a better chance of holding up over time. It just seems
to me if I am going to build me a car to drive, limiting it's
performance potential by installing a given weak transmission is not the
smartest way to go about it. But some times it might be. I dunno.
I would also seem to me as a guess anyway, that money spent trying to
have an adapter made to mate a Jeep transmission to a torque tube drive
live could be better spent by installing a live rear axle through a
variety of means and then spend $60.00 on having a drive shaft made.
Nobody ever said this hobby is cheap, either you have to have good
access to junk yard parts at almost no cost, a lot of skill in the cut
and weld categories or a lot of money to buy kits and then have them
installed. It also helps to know which end of a hammer to hold when you
are beating on things too!
I think Doc said that he had about $15,000 in his Hornet that he is
working very hard on. That is a reasonable number for the most part and
one that can be expected to have. I put that much into my Spirit but I
can do more things than Doc did for no other reason than my health is
better even if only slightly so. My big ticket items were a complete
interior and an over the counter fuel injection kit and having my
painting done. These were things that I had to go outside my
capabilities to obtain.
Most of my restification work or modifying has been well under a third
of that number but than again I am not looking to buy a set of big hoop
designer wheels and tires at $4000.00 + just so I can see my powder
coated 6 piston rear disc brake conversions at another $2000.00 or so. I
can be satisfied with a set of 17 inch wheels scarfed off of a Dodge
Caravan and tires from Wal-Mart if I have to. The rear drum brakes will
stop the car just fine thank you.
The rest of that $6000.00 will go into the motor and setting up what
ever I use for a transmission to make it fun for me to drive.
Who knows, when I get current projects cleaned up I might even purchase
a wrecked Acura with all the bells and whistles on it and transplant the
goodies into a Pacer. That could be fun.
John.
------------------------------
Message: 8
Date: Wed, 14 Jun 2006 08:23:40 -0000
From: <francis.swygert@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] my 62 classic project
To: <das24rules@xxxxxxxxx>, <amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Message-ID:
<8B4C911BEBA5E24888E353FF362B9E7702E65F96@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Dave, you can just use the extension housing and shifter from a S-10 T-5
and put that on a Mustang T-5. The parts interchange, but you have to
have both transmissions. I don't know if a 4.3L V-6 came with a five
speed, but that would be a good one to get the trans from if it's a T-5.
The trans tunnel shouldn't be a problem. Only one floor was made, and
since the OD trans is pretty big and will fit, the T-5 won't be a
problem.
-------------
Date: Tuesday, June 13, 2006 01:28 PM
From: d stohler <das24rules@xxxxxxxxx>
is the floor pan a similar length in my 62 classic to use a 'stang
tranny with
tailhousing? i want to still be able to slide my seats forward, as it
makes the
bed. all i have found s10 t5's for is the 4 cyl. im quite sure they are
real
weak arent they? they still are not much cheaper than a stang either.
i am
still unable to know what gear i might have in the axle now. someone
posted
gear for an o/d equiped. i guess they didnt read that i was a non o/d
putting
one in. it is a 62 classic custom, 196, 3 speed 2 door.
i supose, if the tail shaft for a stang t5 puts the shifter back to
far, i
can modify the seats in the middle section, when i tear tem down to
reupholster
them. make a gap on the front inner corner of them. its the 50/50 bench.
make
kinda a U shape right between them for the shifter i guess.
------------------------------
Message: 9
Date: Wed, 14 Jun 2006 10:40:27 -0000
From: <francis.swygert@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] Brake Conversion
To: <CitywideTowing@xxxxxxx>, <amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Message-ID:
<8B4C911BEBA5E24888E353FF362B9E7702E65F97@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Paul, go to www.amccf.com/main.html, click on Tech Info, then go down to
disc brakes. The exploded views will show you how to assemble. The
mounting bracket goes on first, then spindle, then dust cover.
--------------
I am trying to do a disc brake conversion , but am running into a
problem .
The problem is it has been a while since I took the parts off the donor
car
and have forgotten the order they go on in . Does the Caliper braket or
the
backing plate or the spindle go first and what is second , From there I
think
I can figure it out . Thank You in Advance as I seem to have lost all
memory
and common sense in this issue
------------------------------
Message: 10
Date: Wed, 14 Jun 2006 07:22:32 -0400
From: AMC74Hornet@xxxxxxxxx (Mr. AMC)
Subject: [AMC-List] New Projects To Start Today
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx, amc_club_of_socal@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx,
BaadAssGremlins@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx, MacsOrphanCarGroup@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <3556-448FF178-142@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII
I love that Jeggs fast mail order service. I ordered a 2 quart larger
904 tranny oil pan a billet over flow tank a tranny oil cooler and an
auxiliary fan last friday. It all arrived tuesday afternoon. Now to
start the installation of the oil cooled and the fan so I can finally
get my grill back in. :-)~
------------------------------
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End of AMC-List Digest, Vol 5, Issue 30
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