AMC-List Digest, Vol 12, Issue 9
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AMC-List Digest, Vol 12, Issue 9
- From: amc-list-request@xxxxxxx
- Date: Thu, 04 Jan 2007 19:39:13 +0000
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Today's Topics:
1. Re: My new 88 (Mark Price)
2. Re: My new 88 (Keleigh Hardie)
3. Re: Jeep Cherokee (Was Hot Rodding Is Dead) (Sandwich Maker)
4. Re: Jeep Cherokee (Was Hot Rodding Is Dead) (Mark Price)
5. Re: Jeep Cherokee (Was Hot Rodding Is Dead) (Savage, Pete)
6. automatic to manual swap in 65 classic (d stohler)
7. Re: Jeep Cherokee (Was Hot Rodding Is Dead) (Sandwich Maker)
8. Fw: AMC Spirit WANTED must be 4cyl, 4spd. (Eddie Stakes)
9. Former AMC-Associated Stamping Plant Goes Bye-Bye (Archimedes)
10. OT: Troubleshooting Help Needed (Arthur Litchfield)
11. Re: AMX Files (ALL PLEASE READ!!)
(Swygert, Francis G MSgt 436 CES/CECM)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2007 6:16:02 -0800
From: Mark Price <markprice242@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] My new 88
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Cc: Keleigh Hardie <keleigh3000@xxxxxxxxx>
Message-ID: <31979097.1167920162332.JavaMail.root@web24>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
Yeah that makes sense.
Probably explains why the slow engagement is not as bad if you start them, put them into drive for a bit then go to reverse.
We saw a lot of high mileage cars go that way. I'm not a real trans guy the shops around here used to have one trans guy. I've done a few, but it's been a long time now!
Mark Price
markprice242ATadelphia.net
Morgantown, WV
---- Keleigh Hardie <keleigh3000@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> Oh, durr, I just reread you original post. The problem I found in my
> U-Pick-Em 727 would have produced the same slow engagement of reverse,
> eventually taking out top gear as well, particularly when cold. The
> sealing rings between the pump and the D+R clutch drum are probably
> wearing out, with grooves worn in the drum as well. Once warmed up, it
> will usually hold enough pressure to engage the clutch (D+R= direct +
> reverse). It'll gradually get worse. Unless it has a modified valve
> body, it's best to put it in neutral for warming up, full fluid flow...
>
> Keleigh
> _______________________________________________
> AMC-List mailing list
> AMC-List@xxxxxxxxxxxx
> http://www.amc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/amc-list
>
> or go to http://www.amc-list.com
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Thu, 04 Jan 2007 07:39:05 -0700
From: Keleigh Hardie <keleigh3000@xxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] My new 88
To: Mark Price <markprice242@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Cc: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <459D1189.5020105@xxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed
AFAIK, there's only one shift kit on the market that allows full fluid
flow in park and makes an effort to contain converter drainback. IIRC,
it's called something like "Mr Shift No YoYo" or something like that.
(As a bonus, you can check the fluid level in park.)...
Keleigh
Mark Price wrote:
> Yeah that makes sense.
> Probably explains why the slow engagement is not as bad if you start them, put them into drive for a bit then go to reverse.
> We saw a lot of high mileage cars go that way. I'm not a real trans guy the shops around here used to have one trans guy. I've done a few, but it's been a long time now!
>
> Mark Price
> markprice242ATadelphia.net
> Morgantown, WV
>
>
> ---- Keleigh Hardie <keleigh3000@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>
>> Oh, durr, I just reread you original post. The problem I found in my
>> U-Pick-Em 727 would have produced the same slow engagement of reverse,
>> eventually taking out top gear as well, particularly when cold. The
>> sealing rings between the pump and the D+R clutch drum are probably
>> wearing out, with grooves worn in the drum as well. Once warmed up, it
>> will usually hold enough pressure to engage the clutch (D+R= direct +
>> reverse). It'll gradually get worse. Unless it has a modified valve
>> body, it's best to put it in neutral for warming up, full fluid flow...
>>
>> Keleigh
>> _______________________________________________
>> AMC-List mailing list
>> AMC-List@xxxxxxxxxxxx
>> http://www.amc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/amc-list
>>
>> or go to http://www.amc-list.com
>>
>
>
>
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2007 10:31:42 -0500 (EST)
From: adh@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx (Sandwich Maker)
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] Jeep Cherokee (Was Hot Rodding Is Dead)
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <200701041531.l04FVg823939@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
" From: "Jamie Smith" <oconner51@xxxxxxxxxxx>
"
" From: adh@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx (Sandwich Maker)
"
" >" From: "Jamie Smith" <oconner51@xxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:oconner51@xxxxxxxxxxx>>
" >"
" >" I've added a new vehicle to the flock. I have just acquired a 1985
" >" Jeep Cherokee Pioneer. I got it to use as parts for the Comanche but
" >" it is in such good condition I am not sure I want to part it out so
" >" I may just put a motor in it and keep it.
" >
" >idle curiosity - what motor does it have - the v6? what tranny?
"
"
" It has the v6 and auto tranny (don't know what tranny that would be).
that would be the chevy 2.8 and tf904.
you were looking for a tranny for your comanche, right? iirc they
were all made in the aw4 years.
" The previous owner said it runs but leaks oil real bad and has no power.
you have a golden opportunity to replace the 2.8 with the gm 3.4 crate
motor. it's made to replace 2.8s in s10s and takes all the
accessories and manifolds [carb included], but i don't recall if it
has a fuel pump or not... you also can't use the flexplate since it's
for a 700r4, but you can remove the balance weights from your original
and use it. this is 50-state smog legal but even if it wasn't it runs
clean enough and passes visual [duh!]
or if you want more power, you could take the 3.9 v6 and tf999/32rh
from a dakota and swap them both in. i think novak has mounts for the
3.9 if you don't want to fab your own. this should also be legal as
long as the donor is newer than your jeep, and iirc all daks are.
________________________________________________________________________
Andrew Hay the genius nature
internet rambler is to see what all have seen
adh@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx and think what none thought
------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2007 7:46:39 -0800
From: Mark Price <markprice242@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] Jeep Cherokee (Was Hot Rodding Is Dead)
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <30275147.1167925599117.JavaMail.root@web32>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
If any repairs are done to this Jeep, make sure you check out the converter as this setup had a habit of cracking the snout on the converter and tearing the pump up. It's an expensive fix as the convertor is a XJ only item and no other vehicles used it. Last time I heard they were getting very hard to find in good shape or to locate replacements of any sort.
I'd likely look into swapping it out for four cylinder driveline out of a YJ or XJ as this would be the easiest swap. The 4.0L is hard to swap into the pre 87 as the hood and core support is not going to allow the 4.0L in and the factory hood latch to work. I've heard reports the pre 87 has a different firewall too, but I'm not sure anyone has actually prooved this is true. I know of at least on 85 that had a 258 put in it and the guy did not have any firewall issues and use hoodpins for the hood. He started by mounting the trans and transfer case then just made his own engine mounts.
The Dakota V-6 would be a good swap too either the 3.9 or the 3.7 should fit well and be a big improvement over the 2.8. Hey, why not 4.7 ???!!!!!!
--
Mark Price
markprice242ATadelphia.net
Morgantown, WV
---- Sandwich Maker <adh@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> " From: "Jamie Smith" <oconner51@xxxxxxxxxxx>
> "
> " From: adh@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx (Sandwich Maker)
> "
> " >" From: "Jamie Smith" <oconner51@xxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:oconner51@xxxxxxxxxxx>>
> " >"
> " >" I've added a new vehicle to the flock. I have just acquired a 1985
> " >" Jeep Cherokee Pioneer. I got it to use as parts for the Comanche but
> " >" it is in such good condition I am not sure I want to part it out so
> " >" I may just put a motor in it and keep it.
> " >
> " >idle curiosity - what motor does it have - the v6? what tranny?
> "
> "
> " It has the v6 and auto tranny (don't know what tranny that would be).
>
> that would be the chevy 2.8 and tf904.
>
> you were looking for a tranny for your comanche, right? iirc they
> were all made in the aw4 years.
>
> " The previous owner said it runs but leaks oil real bad and has no power.
>
> you have a golden opportunity to replace the 2.8 with the gm 3.4 crate
> motor. it's made to replace 2.8s in s10s and takes all the
> accessories and manifolds [carb included], but i don't recall if it
> has a fuel pump or not... you also can't use the flexplate since it's
> for a 700r4, but you can remove the balance weights from your original
> and use it. this is 50-state smog legal but even if it wasn't it runs
> clean enough and passes visual [duh!]
>
> or if you want more power, you could take the 3.9 v6 and tf999/32rh
> from a dakota and swap them both in. i think novak has mounts for the
> 3.9 if you don't want to fab your own. this should also be legal as
> long as the donor is newer than your jeep, and iirc all daks are.
> ________________________________________________________________________
> Andrew Hay the genius nature
> internet rambler is to see what all have seen
> adh@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx and think what none thought
> _______________________________________________
> AMC-List mailing list
> AMC-List@xxxxxxxxxxxx
> http://www.amc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/amc-list
>
> or go to http://www.amc-list.com
------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2007 11:24:14 -0500
From: "Savage, Pete" <PSavage@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] Jeep Cherokee (Was Hot Rodding Is Dead)
To: <amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Message-ID:
<BD261180E6D35F4D9D32F3E44FD3D901047B6BB6@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
TCI in Mississippi welded a new snout on mine for 100$
-----Original Message-----
From: amc-list-bounces@xxxxxxx [mailto:amc-list-bounces@xxxxxxx]On Behalf Of Mark Price
Sent: Thursday, January 04, 2007 10:47 AM
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] Jeep Cherokee (Was Hot Rodding Is Dead)
If any repairs are done to this Jeep, make sure you check out the converter as this setup had a habit of cracking the snout on the converter and tearing the pump up. It's an expensive fix as the convertor is a XJ only item and no other vehicles used it. Last time I heard they were getting very hard to find in good shape or to locate replacements of any sort.
I'd likely look into swapping it out for four cylinder driveline out of a YJ or XJ as this would be the easiest swap. The 4.0L is hard to swap into the pre 87 as the hood and core support is not going to allow the 4.0L in and the factory hood latch to work. I've heard reports the pre 87 has a different firewall too, but I'm not sure anyone has actually prooved this is true. I know of at least on 85 that had a 258 put in it and the guy did not have any firewall issues and use hoodpins for the hood. He started by mounting the trans and transfer case then just made his own engine mounts.
The Dakota V-6 would be a good swap too either the 3.9 or the 3.7 should fit well and be a big improvement over the 2.8. Hey, why not 4.7 ???!!!!!!
--
Mark Price
markprice242ATadelphia.net
Morgantown, WV
---- Sandwich Maker <adh@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> " From: "Jamie Smith" <oconner51@xxxxxxxxxxx>
> "
> " From: adh@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx (Sandwich Maker)
> "
> " >" From: "Jamie Smith" <oconner51@xxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:oconner51@xxxxxxxxxxx>>
> " >"
> " >" I've added a new vehicle to the flock. I have just acquired a 1985
> " >" Jeep Cherokee Pioneer. I got it to use as parts for the Comanche but
> " >" it is in such good condition I am not sure I want to part it out so
> " >" I may just put a motor in it and keep it.
> " >
> " >idle curiosity - what motor does it have - the v6? what tranny?
> "
> "
> " It has the v6 and auto tranny (don't know what tranny that would be).
>
> that would be the chevy 2.8 and tf904.
>
> you were looking for a tranny for your comanche, right? iirc they
> were all made in the aw4 years.
>
> " The previous owner said it runs but leaks oil real bad and has no power.
>
> you have a golden opportunity to replace the 2.8 with the gm 3.4 crate
> motor. it's made to replace 2.8s in s10s and takes all the
> accessories and manifolds [carb included], but i don't recall if it
> has a fuel pump or not... you also can't use the flexplate since it's
> for a 700r4, but you can remove the balance weights from your original
> and use it. this is 50-state smog legal but even if it wasn't it runs
> clean enough and passes visual [duh!]
>
> or if you want more power, you could take the 3.9 v6 and tf999/32rh
> from a dakota and swap them both in. i think novak has mounts for the
> 3.9 if you don't want to fab your own. this should also be legal as
> long as the donor is newer than your jeep, and iirc all daks are.
> ________________________________________________________________________
> Andrew Hay the genius nature
> internet rambler is to see what all have seen
> adh@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx and think what none thought
> _______________________________________________
> AMC-List mailing list
> AMC-List@xxxxxxxxxxxx
> http://www.amc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/amc-list
>
> or go to http://www.amc-list.com
_______________________________________________
AMC-List mailing list
AMC-List@xxxxxxxxxxxx
http://www.amc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/amc-list
or go to http://www.amc-list.com
------------------------------
Message: 6
Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2007 09:51:18 -0800 (PST)
From: d stohler <das24rules@xxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [AMC-List] automatic to manual swap in 65 classic
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <20070104175118.6438.qmail@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
there is a guy in town who has a 65 classic with 287
or 327. it has an automatic in it. it has fluid lines
going into the radiator. im not sure what auto it is.
i still have that t86/r10. would that be able to be
swapped into the 65 very easily? i have another 62
classic out of town for parts only. its a 3 speed
manual. would i be able to use the clutch system out
of that one to put into the 65? what about
bellhousing. how hard is it to find a bellhousing to
mate that trans up to that engine? would the tourqe
tube/driveshaft be a different length? sounds to me
like it might be a lot of work. if i could get parts
the guy might do the swap and put that trans/od in
use.
dave stohler
lawton/ft. sill ok
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
------------------------------
Message: 7
Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2007 13:28:21 -0500 (EST)
From: adh@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx (Sandwich Maker)
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] Jeep Cherokee (Was Hot Rodding Is Dead)
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <200701041828.l04ISLj26162@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
" Subject: Re: [AMC-List] Jeep Cherokee (Was Hot Rodding Is Dead)
"
" If any repairs are done to this Jeep, make sure you check out the
" converter as this setup had a habit of cracking the snout on the
" converter and tearing the pump up. It's an expensive fix as the
" convertor is a XJ only item and no other vehicles used it. Last time I
" heard they were getting very hard to find in good shape or to locate
" replacements of any sort.
a word to the wise. maybe have the tranny checked out completely
while you're at it.
" I'd likely look into swapping it out for four cylinder driveline out
" of a YJ or XJ as this would be the easiest swap.
if you had the -complete- drivetrain from an xj it might be easiest,
but if it's injected you'd also need the harness, ecm, and fuel tank
with pump... a yj wouldn't have the tank or driveshafts in the event
the t/c gets relocated - or probably usable mounts either.
" The 4.0L is hard to
" swap into the pre 87 as the hood and core support is not going to allow
" the 4.0L in and the factory hood latch to work. I've heard reports the
" pre 87 has a different firewall too, but I'm not sure anyone has
" actually proved this is true. I know of at least one 85 that had a 258
" put in it and the guy did not have any firewall issues and use hoodpins
" for the hood. He started by mounting the trans and transfer case then
" just made his own engine mounts.
maybe the engine ended up farther fwd than the stock 4.0 setup?
" The Dakota V-6 would be a good swap too either the 3.9 or the 3.7
" should fit well and be a big improvement over the 2.8. Hey, why not
" 4.7 ???!!!!!!
i was thinking an early dak carbed 3.9 and non-electronic tf would
minimize the thrash involved in swapping. the 3.7 and 4.7 are efi
only and would come with trannies longer than the original 904. this
starts to ripple through the drivetrain...
if you want to get nutball, the new hemi should fit as well as the
4.7; it was designed to have the same envelope. or, if it had been a
stick with a t5 [they used t5s and ax5s apparently interchangeably],
beef the tranny - essentially put the jeep mainshaft and extension
case on a ford svt 7003z box - and drop in a caddy pushrod 4.9. i've
heard mcleod has a flywheel for this. afaik you can use the jeep
bellhousing!
btw there are now two z-code t5s - the original with 2.95 1st and a
new one with 3.35 1st. both are rated at 330 ft-lbs.
" " " ---- Sandwich Maker <adh@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
" > " From: "Jamie Smith" <oconner51@xxxxxxxxxxx>
" > "
" > " From: adh@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx (Sandwich Maker)
" > "
" > " >" From: "Jamie Smith" <oconner51@xxxxxxxxxxx>
" > " >"
" > " >" I've added a new vehicle to the flock. I have just acquired a 1985
" > " >" Jeep Cherokee Pioneer.
" > " >" []
" > "
" > " It has the v6 and auto tranny (don't know what tranny that would be).
" >
" > that would be the chevy 2.8 and tf904.
" >
" > " The previous owner said it runs but leaks oil real bad and has no power.
" >
" > you have a golden opportunity to replace the 2.8 with the gm 3.4 crate
" > motor. it's made to replace 2.8s in s10s and takes all the
" > accessories and manifolds [carb included], but i don't recall if it
" > has a fuel pump or not... you also can't use the flexplate since it's
" > for a 700r4, but you can remove the balance weights from your original
" > and use it. this is 50-state smog legal but even if it wasn't it runs
" > clean enough and passes visual [duh!]
" >
" > or if you want more power, you could take the 3.9 v6 and tf999/32rh
" > from a dakota and swap them both in. i think novak has mounts for the
" > 3.9 if you don't want to fab your own. this should also be legal as
" > long as the donor is newer than your jeep, and iirc all daks are.
" > ________________________________________________________________________
" > Andrew Hay the genius nature
" > internet rambler is to see what all have seen
" > adh@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx and think what none thought
" > _______________________________________________
" > AMC-List mailing list
" > AMC-List@xxxxxxxxxxxx
" > http://www.amc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/amc-list
" >
" > or go to http://www.amc-list.com
"
________________________________________________________________________
Andrew Hay the genius nature
internet rambler is to see what all have seen
adh@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx and think what none thought
------------------------------
Message: 8
Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2007 11:59:41 -0600
From: "Eddie Stakes" <eddiestakes@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [AMC-List] Fw: AMC Spirit WANTED must be 4cyl, 4spd.
To: <baadassGremlins@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>, <mail@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Message-ID: <021e01c73031$6a349470$abf1b148@piageedc1iqa5q>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Anyone with something like below give them a shout, thanks,
Eddie Stakes'
Planet Houston AMX
713.464.8825
eddiestakes@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
www.planethoustonamx.com
Email is currently HEAVY
5-12 day reply times, call if important
----- Original Message -----
From: Kelly Tipton jktipton@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
To: eddiestakes@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Thursday, January 04, 2007 8:53 AM
Subject: WTB: AMC Spirit must be 4cyl, 4spd.
Eddie,
I'm having trouble posting to the list so I was hoping to route this through you.
I am looking for a NICE (no rust project projects) Spirit w/ the iron duke 4cyl and 4spd manual trans. A/C would be a plus. Car does not need to be running, but the body and interior must be in good shape.
Again, must be a nice or close to perfect car. Have money in hand. Willing to travel from Texas throughout the Southeast for pick-up.
Thanks in advance...........
------------------------------
Message: 9
Date: Wed, 03 Jan 2007 09:31:20 -0500
From: Archimedes <Freedom@xxxxxxxx>
Subject: [AMC-List] Former AMC-Associated Stamping Plant Goes Bye-Bye
To: (Recipient list suppressed)
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.1.20070103092653.02b1f6d8@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed
From: http://wvgazette.com/section/Today/200701018
*****************************************************
Closed, future uncertain
Union Stamping and Assembly in South Charleston threw in the towel and
declared bankruptcy after union workers declined to make another round of
concessions that would have substantially trimmed wages that averaged
$17.21 an hour.
The plant had 525 workers when Cleveland-based Union Partners LLC bought
the plant from Mayflower Vehicle Systems two years ago, and had nearly 800
workers three years ago.
Park Corp. of Cleveland has owned the building since 1969 and over the
years has leased it to American Motors Corp., Chrysler Corp., Volkswagen of
America Inc., Checker Motors Corp., Mayflower and Union Stamping. In early
December, U.S. Bankruptcy Court Judge Ronald Pearson approved Park's $18
million offer to buy the massive presses and other equipment inside.
That seemed like a ray of hope. By yearend, Ray Park had hired 20 to 25
people to paint, put in new lights and repair the roof and floors. He also
brought in John Wise, who once managed the plant, to help repair the machinery.
*****************************************************
-- end --
------------------------------
Message: 10
Date: Wed, 03 Jan 2007 16:03:59 -0500
From: Arthur Litchfield <artl@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [AMC-List] OT: Troubleshooting Help Needed
To: amcrelay@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID:
<ADVANCES62QtgTIFprh00000368@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain
Good afternoon all. I have a problem with my 98 S10. For some reason,
I have no left turn signal (rear only) or brake light. I have switched
bulbs a couple of times, put in a new flasher, unhooked my trailer
harness and nothing seems to fix it. Head lights and tail lights work
all the way around, just no blinky on the left side. Any help or
suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks,
Art in Idaho
=============================================================
Posted by wixList Archiver -- http://www.amxfiles.com/wixlist
------------------------------
Message: 11
Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2007 13:38:33 -0600
From: "Swygert, Francis G MSgt 436 CES/CECM"
<Francis.Swygert3@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] AMX Files (ALL PLEASE READ!!)
To: "Art Litchfield" <artl@xxxxxxxxxxx>, <mail@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Message-ID:
<4CC05BF0CC3F114281434B00B733E2A31D06AB@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
-----Original Message-----
Sent: Thursday, January 04, 2007 10:08 AM
To: Swygert, Francis G
Subject: AMX Files
Hey Frank,
Art in Idaho here. I was wondering if you could look into why nothing I
send to the list makes it there. I have posted a couple of items and
nothing shows up.
Thanks
------Answer----------------------------------------
Sorry for the length of this message, but it has to be to explain what's
going on!
WHY THIS HAPPENS
I can tell you why the messages aren't coming up within an hour or two.
That's because you're using the web interface at www.amxfiles.com to
send them. The website interface changes the addressing around so that
the messages appear to come from the sender instead of amxfiles.com,
which is the actual sender as far as the list software is concerned. The
website is a list member just like you, except that it displays the
incoming messages and has an interface for replies. The problem is that
some of the systems the reply goes through doesn't like the way the
addresses have been changed. Most spammers mess with the address to make
it look like it came from a legitimate address or to hide the spammers
address. The system "sees" this and flags it as possible spam.
I say "some" systems because most go through with no problems, others
(such as even from my home address) get flagged as having the addresses
messed with. The list serve software then puts these messages on hold
until a moderator can check and release it or delete it because they
could be spam. Tom and I can't put a finger on why messages from some
users get flagged but most don't. The only thing I can think of is that
some system somewhere along the path the message takes does something
else to the address or flags it before it reaches our server.
Tom and I both get "moderator request" messages in our e-mail (my home
e-mail, not work as I'm replying from now) when this happens. I read my
e-mail at least daily 90% of the time. When I see a moderator request I
go to the site and review the messages. If the subject looks "right" for
the list I immediately release it. That means if you send a message
after say 9 pm, it may not get released until 6-10 pm the next day --
depends on when I read my e-mail (or Tom). Since Tom and I are on
different coasts, there is usually less than 24 hours between send and
release.
HOW TO PREVENT THIS
This is simple -- send messages through your e-mail program and NOT
through the "reply" button on the amxfiles. That's why I have my work
e-mail as a member that doesn't receive mail. Otherwise nothing I sent
would go through until I got home and released it. With most e-mail
programs you can click on the highlighted/underlined "from" name on the
amxfiles screen and a reply box to that person with the subject line
will pop up (this is how Outlook works anyway). Then you can add
"mail@xxxxxxxxxxxx" as a "to" or "cc" address, then delete the poster's
address (if you don't want to send directly to them as well). You'd have
to cut and paste any text you want to quote though. This is more work,
but your message will immediately go out to the list, and should be
posted to the amxfiles site within an hour or two.
Any message sent to "mail@xxxxxxxxxxxx" will automatically go to all
list members (including the amxfiles site). New messages can be
generated that way, or replies can be generated directly. Just make sure
you put in an appropriate subject line and cut and paste anything that
needs to be quoted. If the subject is the same as the message you're
replying to, a reader can always go back and read previous messages (no
real need to quote). I do this all the time, as I did for this message.
WHAT ARE THE LIST MODERATORS DOING ABOUT IT?
No offense to Jim Stone, but his software was written quite a few years
ago, when the Internet was a bit friendlier (it really is a nice piece
of software). If tom and I turned most of the spam protection off
everything would be fine, but we're NOT going to do that. Tom much risk
to the server and to members. What we are doing is looking for a web
interface that we can put directly on the server that will display and
allow a reply similar to the current display format. We haven't found
anything, though I must admit it's not a pressing issue for us. If
anyone knows of such a piece of software please let us know! We can get
the source for the amxfiles software (it's available from Jims site) if
someone is programmer enough to either fix the security issue or use it
as a guide to write something that will work from the server. We don't
want to cut Jim out of the loop -- he's provided this service for way to
long to do that. If we do find another software package the amxfiles
site will remain in service as is for as long as Jim wants to maintain
it. But unless the security issue if fixed (I'm not sure it can be) this
problem will remain -- some people (for unknown reasons, and this
includes me) will have their messages placed on hold for up to 24 hours,
and in rare cases longer (doubtful that Tom and I will be away from
e-mail at the same time, but possible).
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End of AMC-List Digest, Vol 12, Issue 9
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