AMC-List Digest, Vol 10, Issue 22
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AMC-List Digest, Vol 10, Issue 22
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- Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2006 01:06:42 +0000
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Today's Topics:
1. Re: List No#'S, Post's And So On (Sandwich Maker)
2. 200 miles on this rebuild??? (Justin Shelton)
3. Re: Disc rear interchanges/Was/Re: speaking of carburetors
(Jim Blair)
4. Re: Numb3rs (Jim Blair)
5. Re: 61 original window sticker (Eddie Stakes)
6. Re: combination valve (Jim Blair)
7. Re: IM HOME FROM IRAQ!!! (Jim Blair)
8. Re: 200 miles on this rebuild??? (Tom Jennings)
9. Sticker shock (Mahoney, John)
10. Fwd: Discount on RockAuto Parts! (Mark Price)
11. Re; Disc rear interchanges/now Eagle Fender Flares (John Elle)
12. Re: Re; '61 Original original "retail price label" (Michael Pell)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2006 09:21:11 -0500 (EST)
From: adh@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx (Sandwich Maker)
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] List No#'S, Post's And So On
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <200611091421.kA9ELBU20255@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
" From: AMC74Hornet@xxxxxxxxx (Mr. AMC)
"
" I figured no one would be interested in the JC Whitney Aouga Horn my
that's called a klaxon, why i don't know but i'd speculate it was the
original company that invented them or their brand name. i've seen
all mechanical versions that must date to the teens or early '20s at
least.
they were also famous as the dive warning horn on ww2 subs.
________________________________________________________________________
Andrew Hay the genius nature
internet rambler is to see what all have seen
adh@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx and think what none thought
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2006 06:43:23 -0800
From: Justin Shelton <hydeparker@xxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [AMC-List] 200 miles on this rebuild???
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <1E17C6FA7F6.00000242hydeparker@xxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Hmmm . . . seller claims only 200 miles on this engine, yet it looks pretty grimey. Even if that rebuild was done 10 years ago, I'm not sure how so much oiley grime would have accumulated on the valve cover and block, even if it was parted out in an open field.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1962-Rambler-Classic_W0QQitemZ320047070104QQihZ011QQcategoryZ6783QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Thu, 09 Nov 2006 11:26:12 -0800
From: "Jim Blair" <carnuck@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] Disc rear interchanges/Was/Re: speaking of
carburetors
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <BAY114-F19BA02E61597B6E6492FBDACF00@xxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
I meant that on the '82 Spirit, the wheel wells are shallower than the
Eagle, so if my friend put an XJ axle in (which is 2" wider) with XJ rims
(to tuck the tires further in) in the "normal" Spirit axle position (axle on
top of springs) the tires may still stick out past the wheel well openings
and/or hit the fender lip or top. Eagles got around this issue with fender
flares and the axle under the springs (which gave it 4" of lift too)
BTW, Eagle rims are the same offset and width as 2wd XJ/MJ rims.
From: " Russell T. Neyhart" <rtneyhart@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] Disc rear interchanges/Was/Re: speaking
of
carburetors
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID:
<23928616.1163023048145.JavaMail.root@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
I'm not sure what this is the answer "A:" to... I was just
stating what wheels fit on my Eagle in regard to bolt pattern
and offset although I didn't make that clear. I'm not clear as
to how the position the leaf springs (over or under the axle)
would affect the position of the wheels where flares would make
a difference.
Russell
-----Original Message-----
>From: Jim Blair <carnuck@xxxxxxxxxxx>
>Sent: Nov 8, 2006 11:19 AM
>To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
>Subject: Re: [AMC-List] Disc rear interchanges/Was/Re: speaking
of carburetors
>
>A: The Eagle has fender flares and it's sprung over in the back
so XJ wheels
>fit fine. '82 Spirit is sprung under.
>
_________________________________________________________________
Try the next generation of search with Windows Live Search today!
http://imagine-windowslive.com/minisites/searchlaunch/?locale=en-us&source=hmtagline
------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Thu, 09 Nov 2006 11:41:09 -0800
From: "Jim Blair" <carnuck@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] Numb3rs
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <BAY114-F16387D8F7735BB9325B472ACF00@xxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
A: Many have drifted off (some due no doubt to the huge increase in fuel
costs last year costing them the ability to keep more than a daily driver)
and others have migrated to a "clique" of like minded (modelled?) car owners
such as the amc_eagle@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx list and various Jeep marque lists
(I'm on Grand Cherokee, MJ, 2 XJ, 5 FSJ, FSJ/XJ, renixpower, NWWheelers.com,
snort4x4.com, naxja.org, lpg, and other lists. I only spend @ 21 hours a
week on the net. Generally in the AM before work and an hour or so after and
my days off)
PS: Numb3rs was one of my favorite shows, but I hardly watch the box anymore
unless it's news or cartoon channel.
From: "Mahoney, John" <jmahoney@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [AMC-List] Numb3rs
To: <amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Message-ID:
<BFF496024CD8E8499845576906CA0F190D2FEF@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
611 AMC listers? Wasn't it ~750 at the last report? I remember
when there were 1200!
Only 10% seem to do the heavy lifting. Wonder where AMC's
going? Or where it's gone?
_________________________________________________________________
Get FREE company branded e-mail accounts and business Web site from
Microsoft Office Live
http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/mcrssaub0050001411mrt/direct/01/
------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2006 13:56:06 -0600
From: "Eddie Stakes" <eddiestakes@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] 61 original window sticker
To: <mail@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Message-ID: <02c201c70439$1b827550$e8f3b148@piageedc1iqa5q>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
reply-type=original
Wow $7.50 for a oil bath in 1961. I can give my old lady Paige a "Oil Bath"
for $1.00 10W-30 weight from Dollar Store in 2006. I guess it pays to know
where to shop for the finer things in life.
What a neat old Rambler wagon, this looks like the one we had in mid 1960s
except our's had been painted purple! It seemed to have a different set of
headlights if I recall, maybe memory is fading, but I think ours had only
one headlight per side?
Eddie Stakes'
Planet Houston AMX
713.464.8825
eddiestakes@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
www.planethoustonamx.com
Email is currently HEAVY
5-12 day reply times, call if important
------------------------------
Message: 6
Date: Thu, 09 Nov 2006 12:02:46 -0800
From: "Jim Blair" <carnuck@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] combination valve
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <BAY114-F19EF36E864BC2A151D83FBACF00@xxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
A: Are the wheel cylinders new? If so, they may have been switch for ones
for something else, which are slightly larger diameter. I went with Eagle
cylinders on my MJ which gave me better stopping power than the stock ones,
but I can lockup the rear easier. (I removed the load level sensor when I
did a SOA lift in the back. I plan to install a universal valve to adjust it
later when my wife will be driving it, AFTER the auto conversion I should be
out working on now! Just a little chilled today with tonsillitis AGAIN!)
The stock valve can be a push or pull to reset, but the brake light
inside should come on to tell you it's stuck unless the valve has been
tampered with. Many Jeep owners take the valve apart when it jams and remove
the Orings altogether, then reassemble it. I prefer the universal adjustable
valve.
Are the rear drums new? HD brake shoes? Ebrake adjusted correctly? Shoes
adjusted correctly? If there is "slop" in the shoe adjustment, then
sometimes they will grab (pedal will be lower than normal) Oil weeping from
an axle seal or wheel cylinder? Did you maybe put 2 short shoes on one side?
(that'll do it every time! Found that out when I did an emergency repair
after losing a tire)
From: Wayne E LaMothe <superglider@xxxxxxxx>
Subject: [AMC-List] combination valve
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <20061108.120537.1292.0.superglider@xxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
I am trying to trace a problem in the brakes on my 83 Eagle. I
am
getting premature (very) rear wheel lockup when braking.
EVERYTHING but
the combo valve is new. My questions are these:
1. Is this a bendix or kelsey hayes valve?
2. Is there a centering pin? There seems to be but it does not
move so
I think it is sending all the braking to the rear wheels.
Can anyone shed some light on this?
Thanks
Wayne
_________________________________________________________________
Find a local pizza place, music store, museum and more?then map the best
route! http://local.live.com?FORM=MGA001
------------------------------
Message: 7
Date: Thu, 09 Nov 2006 12:11:45 -0800
From: "Jim Blair" <carnuck@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] IM HOME FROM IRAQ!!!
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <BAY114-F32CFCF3BF47F8E9F3D5564ACF00@xxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
A: I found some MJs use a "dummy" hub that looks like a 4x4 hub and bearing,
but has a dummy shaft in it in place of the axle end. I keep one in case of
broken axle/bent hub issue when wheeling or going on a long trip. I can do
the swap in less than an hour (when I'm not freezing or boiling) and be back
on the road in a flash.
" From: "Jim Blair" <carnuck@xxxxxxxxxxx>
"
" A: Go try early XJ/Eagle rotors.
as well as eagles these were used on all 2wd and 4wd mj, xj, and
yj
before '90. after that 2wd got a 1-piece hub/rotor, but they
still
use the same #6/#2 bearings as amc.
________________________________________________________________________
Andrew Hay the genius nature
internet rambler is to see what all
have seen
adh@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx and think what none
thought
--------
_________________________________________________________________
Use your PC to make calls at very low rates
https://voiceoam.pcs.v2s.live.com/partnerredirect.aspx
------------------------------
Message: 8
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2006 13:07:26 -0800 (PST)
From: Tom Jennings <tomj@xxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] 200 miles on this rebuild???
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.64.0611091302560.13202@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
On Thu, 9 Nov 2006, Justin Shelton wrote:
>
> Hmmm . . . seller claims only 200 miles on this engine, yet it looks pretty grimey. Even if that rebuild was done 10 years ago, I'm not sure how so much oiley grime would have accumulated on the valve cover and block, even if it was parted out in an open field.
>
> http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1962-Rambler-Classic_W0QQitemZ320047070104QQihZ011QQcategoryZ6783QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
I doubt that motor was rebuilt within the last 100K mi/20
years. It's got classic (sic) long term leakage around the fuel
pump gasket; front of valve cover leaking oil, blown back by
the fan, etc.
It's so obviously wrong, and the seller's feedback so good,
that it is probably some really dumb listing mistake, rather
than outright lying to deceive. Might be that the seller is
totally ignorant of car tech and someone told him "it's rebuilt"
nad he has no way to tell himself. But in that case it would
be better to say "previous owner claims it was ..."
------------------------------
Message: 9
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2006 16:21:27 -0500
From: "Mahoney, John" <jmahoney@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [AMC-List] Sticker shock
To: <amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Message-ID:
<BFF496024CD8E8499845576906CA0F190D2FF0@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>>
I figured no one would be interested in the JC Whitney Aouga Horn my
father put in his new 69 Rebel that I have had in every one of my second
cars
<<
I once borrowed one and had it temporarily wired into my '34 P-A 840A (150HP@3400RPM from 385CI with 5.50:1CR --- since you're into engine specs these days)
and then drove it to a PAS picnic at a verry fawncy house. I arrived quite late to be sure all were assembled and "ah-hooga-ed" up their long driveway --- sounding just like a Model T or A Ford. When everyone wanted the hood raised to see what was making the racket, this looks like what they saw. Priceless.
http://tinyurl.com/yjdp9d
And Pierce-less: fun day. Honk if you like laughter --- or old cars.
http://www.classicandexotic.com/inventory/pierce.htm
http://www.flickr.com/photos/chadnibal/191499472/
(Disclaimer: that's not my 840 --- or me --- in any of those photos...)
>>
that's called a klaxon, why i don't know but i'd speculate it was the
original company that invented them or their brand name. i've seen
all mechanical versions that must date to the teens or early '20s at
least.
<<
The electrical version, credited to Miller Hutchison (who had worked with Thomas Edison), was not named "Klaxon" until 1908 --- after manufacturing rights had been bought by a parts maker in New Jersey,
http://tinyurl.com/utmn8
whose president, F. W. Lovell, used the Greek verb "klazo" (to make big scary noises while attacking your enemies) for his product name.
Klaxons were the first electrical devices commonly installed in cars: they used 6 volt dry cells, later rechargeable [woowoo] batteries.
Who sez we're so hot (cool?) because we got iPods and cell phones?
But, as John Elle just observed, our automotive world has changed.
http://www.clublexus.com/gallery/data/500/medium/LS460L_005.jpg
http://www.clublexus.com/gallery/data/500/medium/LS460L_006.jpg
http://www.clublexus.com/gallery/data/500/medium/LS460L_024.jpg
http://www.clublexus.com/gallery/data/500/medium/LS460L_028.jpg
http://tinyurl.com/yh5mfk
It's good that cars still need help from human hands:
http://www.autoshop101.com/
http://www.autoecu.com/Products/default.asp
And "Blaat!" Klaxons still sound in the UK and Italy:
http://www.klaxonsignals.com/
http://82.193.8.13/index.aspx?
We don't need to put ALL auto history in the junkyard.
Some of it may even warrant the attention of AMC fans.
If you didn't buy this old eBay AM car:
Item number: 200042381476
you may plan to build this new "AMX/4":
Item number: 170044631956
(If you're too lazy to cut-and-paste, you are no fan.)
19,134 - 17,450 = 1684. # AMX versus # Alpines built.
If that engenders another dig from "Doc", be my guest.
Without words --- or numbers --- there's nothing left.
So be it.
Just think what might have happened if the GTA launched in 1984 --- the famous line of sports cars that had gunned for Porsche: quick (a 6 sec. 0-60), fast (a 150mph top speed), responsive (grippier than a 911) and a comfortable (French, after all), quiet, long-distance machine (it even had rear seats like the Javelin/AMX!) that was also rust-resistant (fiberglass) and, ahem, reliable (in Europe, at least!) that would have used the Douvrin V-6 straight out of the Renault-AMC (R25) Premier and would have shared a money-saving supply of interior bits (one reason -AMC- re-styled the sedan's interior: any AMX would have used some of the same pieces) too --- just imagine what an '86 AMX/4, even before being bumped to 250hp (for a 165mph top), could have done to a less, ahem, "modern" icon of America.
http://tinyurl.com/yxols6
http://www.delorean.co.uk/turboarticlepics/gta.jpg
Can you see the the Spirit of the Pace Car for PPG in it?
If you can't, can't you build an online American Center?
Where every AMC word, number, and image can be found?
I guess it's completely hopeless. No way, no how.
But back then...
GM might have made a different C4 CERV.
Honda might have made an earlier NSX.
AMC might have made another decade.
Rambler might have made history.
But American Motors didn't.
And now it's long dead.
Like Frank, I'll be off awhile, so here's something to discuss:
How was a genuine Duesenberg engine part of the AMC family tree?
How was Western New York a part of that motor's story --- twice?
Or thrice --- if you count the maker of its non-electronic carb.
Make "Rambler Mentality" mean more than cheap, old, and oddball.
And laugh while learning. Life can be smart and funny at once.
"Hey, Mr. Rose, we're back to swap the battery in your Buick."
"You should be all set for winter now. That'll be two bucks."
http://www.rootsweb.com/~miporthu/Gaffney/Streets_06NOV1930.jpg
"Methanol's OK too. Ethylene/Propylene Glycol? What's that?"
"You been readin' them new comic strips: this ain't 1937 yet!"
http://www.biglittlebooks.com/buck_rogers.html
------------------------------
Message: 10
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2006 15:15:28 -0800
From: Mark Price <markprice242@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [AMC-List] Fwd: Discount on RockAuto Parts!
To: AMC List <mail@xxxxxxxxxxxx>, Strokers <strokers@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Message-ID: <5337670.1163114128658.JavaMail.root@web25>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
Anyone need anything from RockAuto?
Here's a way to save a buck or two!
--
Mark Price
markprice242ATadelphia.net
Morgantown, WV
> To: markprice242@xxxxxxxxxxxx
> From: RockAuto Customer Service <service@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Subject: Discount on RockAuto Parts!
> Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2006 02:04:34 -0600
>
> Thank you for being a www.RockAuto.com customer! To show our appreciation, we have a special discount for you.
>
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>
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>
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>
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> * In our non-Java Catalog, enter your code in the "Discount Code" field of the Shopping Cart and click "Calculate Discount."
>
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>
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>
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>
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>
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>
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>
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>
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>
> Tom Taylor
> VP Marketing
> www.rockauto.com
> service@xxxxxxxxxxxx
> 1-866-ROCKAUTO (1-866-762-5288)
> (608) 661-1376
>
>
> If you no longer want to receive discounts or any other mail from RockAuto, click on the link below:
> http://www.rockauto.com/emaillist/emailunsub.php?step=remove&email=markprice242@xxxxxxxxxxxx
------------------------------
Message: 11
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2006 18:01:33 -0700
From: "John Elle" <johnelle@xxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [AMC-List] Re; Disc rear interchanges/now Eagle Fender Flares
To: mail@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <000001c70463$c54deb80$40de0d82@john1>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
I am not sure all of the following is correct;
Snip
I meant that on the '82 Spirit, the wheel wells are shallower than the
Eagle, so if my friend put an XJ axle in (which is 2" wider) with XJ
rims
(to tuck the tires further in) in the "normal" Spirit axle position
(axle on
top of springs) the tires may still stick out past the wheel well
openings
and/or hit the fender lip or top. Eagles got around this issue with
fender
flares and the axle under the springs (which gave it 4" of lift too)
Snip
If my some what aging memory is not overly faulty it seemed to me that
the Eagle had to be lifted to allow all of the four wheel drive
mechanics fit under the chassis. This was the primary reason for lifting
although at the time 4 wheel drive vehicles had more ground clearance
than 2 wheel drive vehicles so that may have been a supporting reason
too. But it seems to me that it had to be raised to get stuff to fit.
Once raised it looked silly, sort of like a Concord driving around on
stilts so the fender flares were incorporated along with the ground
affects to fill in the gap between the fender openings and the wheels
and to visually lower the car. I could be wrong, but it does not seem to
me that the flares were added to enhance the use of wider axles or
tires.
The 1980 product and information hand book lists 15 inch wheels as
standard equipment on the Eagle only and not available on other models.
Although the 1980 AMC TSM lists the tread width front @59.6 inches and
rear @57.6 inches while a Concord is 58.4 inches front and rear is 57.5
The rear numbers are almost identical (these are for a 4 door) which to
me implies pretty much standard interchangeable parts and the difference
between 14 and 15 inch wheels maybe. The front differences could be for
a lot of reasons but probably to give room to get the 4whd parts out to
the front wheels. 1.2 inches or .6 inches per side does not seem very
big looking at it this way.
I am sure the flares allowed some latitude in wheel size and width for
aftermarket but out of the factory I sure believe they were there to
foster the allusion of being lower to the ground.
For what it's worth.
John.
------------------------------
Message: 12
Date: Thu, 09 Nov 2006 20:06:35 -0500
From: Michael Pell <mjpell@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] Re; '61 Original original "retail price label"
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <4553D09B.60307@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed
I thought the anti-freeze item was curious also.
--
I would rather live my life as if there is a God, and die to find out there isn't, Than live my
life as if there isn't, And die to find out there is. -Blaise Pascal
Check out my webpage at http://www.ProStreetCar.com
TREMEC Distributor at http://www.5speedTransmissions.com
Team Chevelle member #1778 (Gold), ACES member #1377
Hoosier State Chevelle Assoc (http://www.IndianaChevelles.com) #6
John Elle wrote:
>
>Looking at the following
>
>Snip
>Who wants to see an original "retail price label" for a '61 Wagon?
>
>See it here: <http://www.indianachevelles.com/pellwagon.html>
>http://www.indianachevelles.com/pellwagon.html (scroll
>to the bottom).
>Snip
>
>Reminds me of some of the automotive infrastructure of the time as the
>industry as it existed then as it experimented with aluminum engines and
>parts such as cylinder heads etc. and for the most part proved to be a
>short term failure. Not so much as the technology or design was bad but
>the engines were prone to over heating problems after a bit of time and
>related types of failures including blown head gaskets etc.
>
>The retail price label makes a point of adding "anti-freeze" to the
>option list. Think about that one for a minute. This is something that
>you would expect to see in your cooling system today. However in 1961 is
>was quite common to just run straight water if you did not live in an
>environment that did not include winter freezing weather. In fact in an
>area of the south that I lived in at that time during the summer months
>anti-freeze was not available in the auto parts stores at all. At that
>time I owned a French car with an aluminum cylinder head that I blew the
>water pump gasket out of racing a Jaguar. Upon getting the car back home
>and making the repair I was unable to purchase anti-freeze to refill the
>radiator so reverting to common practice of the area I just used water.
>Why not? Everyone else did. "sides I had never heard of electrolysis
>before and I knew when I got back north I could get a gallon of
>Prestone.
>
>However about 6 months later I started having overheating problems as
>the interaction between the aluminum head and the cast iron block caused
>the radiator to plug up causing the overheating problems.
>
>Of course now it was winter weather time and after boiling out the
>radiator I was able to purchase a gallon of Anti-Freeze at a Christmas
>Sale or something of that nature.
>
>No wonder aluminum engines or heads got bad press.
>
>Of course the other thing to do is to compare the retail price list to
>what is on car windows now as we read the saga of how much smog
>equipment is installed as "Standard" equipment, as if I really cared or
>how it is equipped with things such as steering wheels, seats and tires
>and other basically essential items we have taken for granted that
>"must" be present on a car in order to consider buying it.
>
>My! How the automotive world has changed, both for what is offered and
>our expectations of what we get.
>
>Some good, some bad and an awful lot just ridiculous.
>John.
>
>_______________________________________________
>AMC-List mailing list
>AMC-List@xxxxxxxxxxxx
>http://www.amc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/amc-list
>
>or go to http://www.amc-list.com
>
>
>
>
--
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.1.409 / Virus Database: 268.14.0/524 - Release Date: 11/8/2006
------------------------------
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End of AMC-List Digest, Vol 10, Issue 22
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