Re: [AMC-List] Mustang II Suspension?

[Mark Price <markprice242@xxxxxxxxxxxx>]

Wow, That's alot of typing to not answer the question. :]
I'm not even remotely considering doing this as I don't have a need.
pg 76 of October issue of Rod and Custom as an article on a cool MII crossmember made in 56", 58", 60" track widths. Called the welder series, Article here
http://www.rodandcustommagazine.com/techarticles/0610rc_crossmember_installation/
It ships flat and you bend and weld it yourself. That's what i'd use for a starting point.
As to arguing, rack or box? Why bother, I find this issue to be very personal. I find a nice rack to be most pleasing, but lest not forget we all started at the box! [I'm really sorry, I had no intentention of going there, but I found it impossible to resist!]
And on that Note I will retire to allow my typing finger to recuperate!
Mark Price
markprice242ATadelphia.net
Morgantown, WV


---- John Elle <johnelle@xxxxxxxxx> wrote: 
> SNIP
> The only thing I can say is if'n I was cuttin I would likely committ
> sacrilege and install the heavier mustang II system. Tha extra room you
> gain
> and the incredible availability of bolt in parts plus the rack just
> plain seem
> to me to out weigh the dissadvantage of it being heavy.
>  Anyone know how much heavier the MII is???
> SNIP
>  
> The simple Mustang II suspension conversion (probably more politically
> correct than referring to it also as the Pinto conversion or Mercury
> Bobcat conversion) has become almost the standard of the industry as
> basic parts in fabricating a some what modern front suspension
> alternative to knee action, solid axle, hard to find or antiquated front
> suspensions of a wide variety of modified cars in the hobby. It too has
> a single bushing lower control arm with a strut rod that goes forward
> rather than rearward in the car leaving the lower control arm to go
> through a weird pivot motion of one bushing and a funky strut rod
> location. 
>  
> The following is from a web site that sells Mustang II suspension
> options. 
> The Mustang II (MII) suspension geometry originally came from the '70
> Pinto. It was designed in the late '60s specifically as a cheap-to-make
> setup for a four-cylinder car with. This made the MII system relatively
> inexpensive for rodders to purchase and fairly simple to install in
> their rods. The real bonus was that it had a narrow track, making it
> perfect for rods, plus it had rack-and-pinion steering-possibly the
> first American car to come so equipped. The system was simple and
> compact, and offered pretty good geometry. Perhaps best of all, the
> crossmember could be purchased separately from the local Ford dealer
> while the remaining components were readily available at the local
> wrecking yard.
>  
> The rest of the article can be read at the following URL;
> http://www.rodandcustommagazine.com/techarticles/custom_mustang_II_suspe
> nsion/
>  
> Since than the basic Pinto parts have been supplemented by aftermarket
> with a full lower control arm supported by 2, not 1 bushing and this
> gets rid of the strut rod!
>  
> By the way a simple web search using Yahoo and Mustang II Suspension as
> an exact phrase came up with 9200+ web sites while the same search using
> the words Trunion +AMC came up with 188. Do I detect a difference in
> popularity?
>  
> I do not know anyone that has actually adapted a Mustang II suspension
> in any form to any AMC automobile. Probably at least one reason is no
> matter what type of suspension the AMC car has for street use, they are
> rebuildable and functional when done and probably with an all ball joint
> suspension well under $250.00 in parts for almost everything and with
> trunions probably well under $600.00 in parts. While most people I know
> do it them selves I am sure a number of people have it done. I have
> rebuild about 2 dozen '70 and newer front suspensions. If that is the
> case my guess that you may see $1500 or so bills on it. Maybe more.
>  
> Now the previously mentioned number does not include adding hubs and
> brakes to the cost but that can be done in parts generally for a number
> between $100 and $500 in parts and once again is usually handled by the
> owner and how good a scrounger he is and what he or she will re-use
> rather than re-place. 
> I have a whole usable disk brake system on a shelf that can be bolted
> onto any AMC car I own that I got for nothing by just stripping a car
> that was going to be crushed. 
>  
> The question was, what is the weight of a Pinto Suspension. That may
> very a bit depending on the source but for the sake of argument let us
> identify the source as Fat Man Fabricators. 
> Url is www.fatmanfab.com <http://www.fatmanfab.com/>  . Their affordable
> IFS starts out as a $1495.00 cost plus shipping. The stage II with
> polished A arms start at $1795. The Stage III with polished stainless,
> pro style shock towers and GENUINE PRO Coil-overes slides in at an even
> $2195 with air suspension only $2795.00. Notice the operative words
> "starts at"!
> Now I am not sure the above numbers are related to weight or not, but
> that seems pretty heavy to me. 'Specially when I can not sell my
> completed and modified Spirit for much over $900.00 and these parts have
> not been installed yet. 
> Now granted these are hub to hub units and the cross member can probably
> substitute for the AMC unit and become the motor mount too, but I have
> not included the cost of welding all of this together, or learning to
> weld or buying a welder. A tool I will bet that many of us do not have.
> I just got mine 5 years ago and I have been in the hobby since 1956.
>  
> An alternative to Fat Man is Street Rod Engineering, URL
> www.streetrodengineering.com <http://www.streetrodengineering.com/>   in
> Lake Havasu. This leaves about 9,198 others to check out to determine if
> this is the type of money that needs to be spent to correct something
> that is not currently broken or if broken can be repaired for something
> under a grand for the most part. 
>  
> I dunno, but I don't see this solution becoming to popular! Is it
> doable? Yuh, I think it is and probably easier than most people realize
> but of course there is the matter of installing the rack and pinion
> steering and getting the steering box hooked up to the steering column
> the power steering modified to work with the rack and pinion and a few
> other minor foibles but I think when said and done it ain't agonna be
> much better than what is in there already. 
>  
> And that seems pretty heavy to me.
> John
>  
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