Re: [Amc-list] How about no fuel at all?

[Wrambler242@xxxxxxxxxxx]

>From what I have seen on other groups the air car is a energy loser.
I.E. It takes more energy to compress the air to drive the car then to simply use the energy to drive the car without making the compressed air. 


--
Mark Price
Morgantown, WV
1969 AMC Rambler, 4.0L, EFI, T-5
2004 Grand Cherokee Laredo, 4.7L, Quadratrc II
" Chronic Pain Hurts"

 -------------- Original message ----------------------
From: Jim Blair <carnuck@xxxxxxxxxxx>
> 
> 
> Jim Blair, Lynnwood, WA '87 Comanche, '83 Jeep J10, '84 Jeep J10
> 
> 
> > Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2007 11:22:57 +0000
> > From: airpoweredvehicles@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > To: airpoweredvehicles@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > Subject: [airpoweredvehicles] Digest Number 227
> > 
> > There is 1 message in this issue.
> > 
> > Topics in this digest:
> > 
> > 1. Lee rogers air car profect - sourcing parts need, plz help guys    
> >     From: ashtweth_nihilistic
> > 
> > 
> > Message
> > ________________________________________________________________________
> > 
> > 1. Lee rogers air car profect - sourcing parts need, plz help guys
> >     Posted by: "ashtweth_nihilistic" ashtweth@xxxxxxxxx ashtweth_nihilistic
> >     Date: Tue Nov 20, 2007 4:31 pm ((PST))
> > 
> > Greetings to all, as you know we have posted the idea we have open
> > sourced in the file sections, we are ready to begin this project and
> > have every thing ready to go. Guys we need help with sourcing some
> > valves if not then we may need to get them customary done.
> > 
> > Guys here are the details and some theory for builders, please let me
> > know if you have any advice for the valves we can then build this for
> > the group!
> > 
> > --------------------------------------------------------
> > 
> > "I have a 3 cylinder 4 stroke engine and a lot of that pneumatic
> > stuff, but no valve that is able to withstand 40 bar pressure and
> > which is able  to open and close within some few milliseconds"
> > 
> > --------------------------------------------------------------
> > 
> > Lee rogers Air car principle:
> > 
> > Have a look for Joule-Thomson-Effect!
> > Read carefully!
> > 
> > Idea is to let HEAT do the job...move the piston...drive the turbine
> > blades, and heat does the job, if you let
> > ********************************************************
> > A GAS EXPAND IN UNDER PRESSURE REGION WHILE IT DOES WORK
> > ********************************************************
> > LR'S engine had problems if driven below 2000 RPM. The reason is
> > simply, that piston movement was to slow, compared to expansion of
> > injected air, so heat didn't the job, but pressure did. Think about
> > it. The key is that simple. I can't understand why we
> > couldn't see it all the time. Don't get caught from vortex too much.
> > Vortex is an ideal heat-to-directed-movement-transformer, but not much
> > more (in this case), so first understand its principle, and then
> > understand that you can have similar effects without a vortex as well.
> > You don't need a 1:1 tornado-model to get energy from heat.
> > All you need is LR and a source for the damned valves!
> > 
> > LR ist simple, and the patent explains all very well.
> > The compressor is not a special one. This part has to be designed
> > simple in a low-losses-manner. The key is, that energy out (air
> > injection -> work) and energy in (re-compression) are not equal
> > events. Compression happens like described in schoolbooks, where we
> > need the formula 
> > *************
> > pxV = nxRxT
> > *************
> > But at the other side we have air INJECTION. Here comes
> > Joule-Thomson-Effect into play, where air releases MORE
> > energy towards piston due to EXPANSION of INJECTED air into a RECEDING
> > medium. Thats the key that no one seems to notice. The air cools down
> > much more due that, than you would calculate with the formula above.
> > Backpumping that cold and dense air makes unit selfsustain.
> > In a sense its easy stuff. You have to insulate the high pressure
> > chamber thermally, and you may have a pressure offset from exhaust
> > back to compressor, a pressure above 1at, so that the compressor does
> > not have to pump from "0" bar, and you can design this "pipe" like a
> > heat exchanger, so you are able to gain HEAT from environment again,
> > to push up the pressure/volume of the precompressed air. The injector
> > valves have to be as near as possible to the cylinder.
> > 
> > 
> > I have a 3 cylinder 4 stroke engine and a lot of that pneumatic stuff,
> > but no valve that is able to withstand 40 bar pressure and which is
> > able to open and close within some few milliseconds. And as soon all
> > parts are there, it will need some experimentation and optimization,
> > as soon all is done right. An overall pre-calculation ist not easy
> > done, as lot of parameters are moving targets, and a lot depends on
> > RPM, injection timing, duration and amount.
> > 
> > PS: If you know how I could get some valves, please let me know. It
> > would be a great help, man.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Messages in this topic (1)
> > ________________________________________________________________________
> > ________________________________________________________________________
> > 
> > 
> > 
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