Another way to get around the long and short of it is to cut and shorten the big car plates. Since the number of Ambo through Jav plates far outnumber the number of American through Spirit plates, there are a bunch out there. My stock usually averages about 8 big car plates for every small car plates. I once measured it once and I think you remove a half an inch.....Russ __________________________________ Yahoo! Music Unlimited Access over 1 million songs. Try it free. http://music.yahoo.com/unlimited/