[Amc-list] TURBO 304

[Brien Tourville <hh7x@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

Good Morning Mr. Phelps,..err Greg,



The builders polled on Bulltear.com on 304 build ups all agreed that
if they went for a Turbo engine - they'd use the 304 as cylinder wall
thickness would be their main concern with AMC / Turbo.

Outside of keeping the bore sizing as close to stock as possible, I'd
substitute a quality One Piece Cast Iron Exhaust Valve - 
presuming you don't want to spend on a set of Iconel.


www.Carburetedblowers@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

www.jyturbo@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx


I'm presuming this is a 'Blow Thru' carb set up -
not a 'Draw Thru' ?


PM Matt @ Bulltear [MC] as to modifying an
Edelbrock for Fuel Injectors for you - he
has a jig & can whip one out.

Mega Squirt ECM controllers have been used
on most AMC EFi / Turbo engines & will
save you a world of pain.

You'll be able to take the car out &
Data Log the engines HP / TQ / AFR 
in one around town run - 
allowing you to make corrections later
on your Lap Top.

Blow Thru Carbs, gone thru for Turbo application
run $600 to $1k. and you'll still be stuck
with problems you won't like after coming
this far.

Of completed AMC engines on the JYTurbo
Archives, those say they'd go EFI if they
had to do it over - too much carb diddling
& not enough control / results.

By using a Data Logging engine management 
we're talking dialing in 40 to 60HP before
tweaks - no lean spots - no rich spots -
no stuck floats - no leaks - power curve
dialed in - results.



- Project sounds pretty "Hairy" -




 



    =BT=
milnersXcoupe



"And the testimony is this, that AMC has given us internal life, and this life is in His 304. He who has the AMC has the life; he who does not have the Turbo of AMC does not have the life."
 - 1 John - George - Ringo - Paul 2.02am











Greg Taylor <amundaza@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
  Good morning all,
Here is the final build-up breakdown for my stroker 304? the reason it has taken me SOOOOOO long to come to a decision, is that I really wanted to find a build that would utilize most of my existing turbo v8 parts, converting them to naturally aspirated street-use and not cost a ton more money. This 327 build fits the bill and will make decent power on the street. The big set back with the AMC turbo parts were the Venolia pistons being built for turbo use at 7.78:1 compression with 62cc ported heads.

BLOCK: 1979 304 V8 - 2 bolt mains with 4140 Moly main cap support straps (center 3 mains). O-ringed deck surface milled 0.010?
CRANK: NOS 390 crank - cross drilled & Auto tranny adapter machined into place (Perf. AM Style mod)
RODS: '68-69 390 rods - resized, shotpeened, deburred and polished, full floating piston pins (bushed for Ford Pinto 2300cc pins 0.9122?), ARP bolts
PISTONS: Keith Black Ford 2300cc pistons 1.59 c/d flat top, at 3.82? bore (0.040? over Pinto ? 0.070? over AMC 304)
HEADS: 1979 304 V8 - ported/polished and enlarged combustion chambers (~62 cc) (porting/polishing via Perf. American Style specs)
VALVES: Small Block Chevy 1.94 intake/1.50 exhaust : stainless steel with undercut stems (will use SBC springs,etc.)
VLVTRN: SB Chevy springs, retainers, guides, keepers, locks
CAM: 0.488? lift AMC cam 218-degrees at 0.050? lift
LIFTERS: Rhodes anti pump-up hydraulic lifters
ROCKERS: 1.6:1 aluminum Roller rockers
OILING: Stock Oil pan. External valley oil supply line for rear mains. New timing cover with Nickle-plated Bulltear Oilpump cover at Hydro-relief gears 
HEADERS: Edelbrock TES Headers for the Jeep Grand Cherokee/Wagoneer into 2.5? single exhaust Dynomax muffler
BOLTS: Milodon Main & Head studs
INTAKE: Offy Dual-Port 360 intake manifold. 1? Poweraid helical bore spacer. Torque-Plus intake gaskets.
CARB: Holley 670-cfm Street Avenger with quick-change jet bowls
CLD AIR: Aluminum 3.5? Cold Air intake for Dodge Dakota with GIGANTIC Cone filter
IGNTN: GM HEI distributor. Bosch Super CU 3-prong plugs (W7DTC). HEI wires

327 V8 STROKER SPECS: 3.82? x 3.82? x 3.574? x .7854 x 8 = 327.7 cid (bore x bore x stroke x percent x #cylinders = cid)


I found a near perfect piston for use in my stroker build up, as well as for use in a stock 304 build-up, should someone want to use a stock crank/rods (not 390 parts). It's for a Ford Pinto 2300cc that has a stock bore is 3.78". Cost runs $111 for FOUR Keith Black pistons at Summit Racing in any size. They have 4.5cc opposing valve reliefs, come with floating pins, spiro-locks and are weight-matched. Here's a couple of links :

http://kb-silvolite.com/performance.php?action=details&P_id=241 (piston details)

http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?part=UEM%2DKB217%2D4&autoview=sku (3.78" bore x 4 ea)

http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?part=UEM%2DKB217040%2D4&autoview=sku (3.82" bore x 4 ea)


Two things are needed to make the Ford Pinto pistons work:
1) Bush rods for Ford 0.912 wrist pins (can fit on 390 and 304 rods)
2) Possibly have to re-cut 1 or 2 valve reliefs in pistons.

Since my 304 block is currently at 3.78" (0.030" overbore 304), if I run the STD bore 3.78" Pinto pistons, I don't have to bore (or deck) my 304 block, as it's at 3.78" now and decked 0.010" for O-rings. Likewise, I don't have to turn my 390 crank and buy different rod bearings.

However, I want to have the block bored to a 3.82" bore (0.040" Pinto oversize ... 0.070" AMC 304 oversize), since it would make an AMC 327(.69") and I could then it would be fitting to run Rambler or Jeep 327 emblems on the sides of my Grand Wagoneer, LOL!


Since my block is decked 0.010" already, the stock 390 rod at 5.79" = 0.031 to deck and yields 8.76:1 (62cc) or 9.04:1 (59cc). Because the 390 rods must be bushed for the smaller Ford wrist pin, I can use my current 62cc heads and get 9.21:1 at 0.005" deck or 9.31:1 at Zero-deck, by offset bushing the rods. I have to measure my exact deck height to know how far to offset bush the rods. Initial cost estimates for having this done range from $240-$280 at the cheapest place recommended, so far.

If someone wanted to build a stock 304 build, with the stock 9.208 block height, a stock 304 crank/rod combo yields a 0.023" deck clearance and 9.0:1 compression, with the .045" thick ROL gasket and a 59cc stock 304 head. If the H-beam 5.885" AMC 360 rods are run (re-bushed to Ford pin) and the deck is milled 0.010", then it would yield a 0.003" clearance and net 9.4:1 compression with a stock 304 59cc head. Of course, the 52.2 cc 1970/71 early 304 heads could be run to raise compression another 0.50, to 9.9:1

Now, to start gather needed parts for the final build!




Sincerely,
Greg Taylor  :)  <><

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