Re: [Amc-list] Thomas Garner, 64 Classic

[Frank Swygert <farna@xxxxxxx>]

If the car had the old 195.6 (often called a 196 for short, and I'll 
call it that from now on), I'd say he's close to right. The 232 would do 
a bit better -- that car should be able to top out closer to 90 mph. 
What transmission do you have? Is it an auto or a stick?  If it's a 
stick, does it have a handle under the dash on the right that has 
"OVERDRIVE" on it? My guess at this point is that it's either an auto 
with a slipping transmission or it's an overdrive that isn't working 
correctly.  I can help troubleshoot the OD, but the auto will have to be 
serviced, or maybe rebuilt. So let's hit this one thing at a time -- 
first off is the transmission type and miles on the car (I don't recall 
seeing either, but...). A tired engine and transmission would be a 
killer combo as far as speed is concerned.

In regards to your other message -- send to just me or the list:
I sent this to the list also. If you think others can help with the 
problem or would be interested in hearing about the fix, reply to the 
list. You can include my address on another line if you want to make 
sure I see the message. If you think a message isn't of much general 
interest, then reply to me only.

Thomas Garner wrote:
> Hello Frank,
>  I live in middle Tennessee and when I go from my house to Nashville, the speed limit is 70 mile an hour. If I get to 60, the engine is rev'ed up extremely high. I have a friend who believes that was top speed for those type's of car's. Is this true? Should I rebuild it? It runs pretty good, just doesn't seem to be very much power. Not trying to race or anything, but hey, 60 is too slow for me. LOL.
>  What do you think? Rebuild the 6 with the adjustments you've mentioned?
>
> Thanks,
> Thomas
>
> --- farna@xxxxxxx wrote:
>
> From: Frank Swygert <farna@xxxxxxx>
> To:  Tgarner@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: Re: Thomas Garner, 64 Classic
> Date: Mon, 06 Aug 2007 20:11:36 -0600
>
> GREAT!!! Only later model 64s got the 232. I looked over your post and 
> see that I missed that the first time, sorry!  You do need to do one 
> thing though -- check this site: 
> http://www.mattsoldcars.com/techinfo/boltmod.shtml.  That's a needed mod 
> for the older head. You can forget about the head bolt retorquing -- 
> that's for the 195.6 only.
>
> The 232, if it's in good condition, will be decent power for the car. 
> I'd consider rebuilding it. If it's not enough there are a few things 
> you can do to it, even add a small 4V carb. I'm looking for one of those 
> now -- they can be pricey! When you rebuild a slightly "bigger" cam, 
> something like an "RV/towing" cam, will really give it a boost in mid 
> range at the expense of 1-2 mpg. A factory 2V carb is a great upgrade also.
>
> Now you need to crawl underneath and see what transmission it has. If 
> it's an air cooled automatic (should be if an aut o-- there will be a 
> large hole in the passenger side of the bell housing and no lines from 
> the trans to the radiator) you're stuck with the 232. That's not all 
> bad, as stated above. If it's a three speed on the column it will have a 
> T-96 or a T-87. Those numbers, usually followed by a letter (something 
> like T-96J) will be cast into the side of the transmission. If it's a 
> T-87 you can likely stick a 287 V-8 in front of it. You'll need a 287 
> and a bell housing for a three speed trans. The 327 won't work -- it 
> used a bigger T-89 transmission. I'm not 100% positive the 232 T-87 and 
> 287 T-87 use the same depth bell housing. If the 287 bell is deeper 
> you'll also need the 287 transmission and torque tube (the tube and 
> internal shaft will be shorter). The good thing is you should have an 
> AMC 20 rear axle! If there is no fill plug in the rear cover it's an AMC 
> 20. That means the V-8 torque tube will bolt to your rear axle, no need 
> to change the axle, just the tube. Again, you may not have to change the 
> tube -- it depends on the depth (distance between trans and engine) of 
> the 287 three speed bell housing. The 327 bell is definitely deeper, but 
> it has the larger T-89 trans. If you get a 327 you still need the bell, 
> trans, and torque tube, but at least you won't need the rear axle. The 
> 232 is uspposed to have the bigger axle, the 195.6 car will have the 
> lighter AMC 15 axle (it has a fill plug in the rear cover -- plug for 
> the AMC 20 is in the center housing toward the front, I believe the 
> passenger side, but might be on driver's side of pinion shaft). A lot of 
> "ifs" here, but that's the best I can do!
>
> Thomas Garner wrote:
>   
>> Actually, mine came with a 232. It says on the side chrome piece that it's a 232. The 63 has a 196 or something like that, but my 64 770 say's 232 on it, so I've always assumed it was a 232.
>>
>> --- farna@xxxxxxx wrote:
>>
>> From: Frank Swygert <farna@xxxxxxx>
>> To:  amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx,  Tgarner@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> Subject: RE: Thomas Garner, 64 Classic
>> Date: Mon, 06 Aug 2007 17:35:42 -0600
>>
>> It's not a bad idea to keep a good parts car when you're driving an old one! 
>> As someone else pointed out, swapping the six requires swapping the  radiator/engine/trans/torque tube/rear axle. The six is a small one (195.6 cubic inches) and the driveline won't take much more power. A relatively easy upgrade is to the newer 199 or 232 six. It all bolts to your transmission, and you just need to move the radiator forward a bit. That's done by changing the brackets from side to side. You'll need a 1964-1971 199 or 232. The bell housing pattern changed in 1972, so a 72 or later six is harder to fit (I've done it, requires some driveline knowledge and fabricating skills, so I won't go into that here). You can get some hop-up parts for the 199/232 engines also, but you don't want to stress the small six trans in the 64 too much. It will be great with one of the larger sixes for cruising, but don't expect to do any drag racing or burn-outs. 
>>
>> I got tired of the Ranco unit in mine and replaced it with a simple on/off valve from NAPA. I got the kind that fits in a 5/8" heater hose, doesn't bolt to anything. Don't know the part number, but they can find it in their catalog. As Tom states, you can tell when the thermostat opens up on a cold day because the heater gets a bit cooler. Not too much so, but noticeable, especially when the heat is on full blast and you're a bit on the cold side! I had that experience when living in Delaware this past two winters. 
>>
>> ------------
>> Date: Sun, 5 Aug 2007 18:01:42 -0700
>> From: "Thomas Garner" <Tgarner@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>
>> Hi,
>>  New to this list.I have a 64 AMC Rambler Classic with a 232. I also have a 63 classic, but due parts being so hard to find, I'm currently using it has a parts car. THe 64 is in great condition, I'm currently fixing small stuff now, but I've been driving it. 
>>  I'm debating on swapping the inline 6 for a V-8. A 287 or 327. I was wondering if anybody knows of either one for sale in my area. (would actually like the tranny to go with the V-8) I live in the middle Tennessee area.
>>  Also, I'm trying to repair the heater valve and have somewhat got it fixed with some seals I found at Lowes. It's not factory, but I got it to work, BUT, it still leaks by a little bit when it's off. Not a huge deal, but I actually like to fix it 100%.
>>  On the Ranco switch, can somebody tell me why it has a little copper coil, kind of like a temp. gauge or sensor? I can't see any purpose in this, since it is completely controlled by the lever inside.
>>  The seat belts are there, but they don't roll up. I think they should, but maybe not. Any info would be helpful.a
>>
>>  That's enough for now, I've got more for later, but that will be a start.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Thomas Garner
>>
>>   
>>     
>
>
>   


-- 
Frank Swygert
Publisher, "American Motors Cars" 
Magazine (AMC)
For all AMC enthusiasts
http://farna.home.att.net/AMC.html
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