AMC-List Digest, Vol 11, Issue 49
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AMC-List Digest, Vol 11, Issue 49
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- Date: Fri, 22 Dec 2006 00:40:24 +0000
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Today's Topics:
1. Re: Another Re; E Stick, now Drivers (Tom Jennings)
2. Re: Another Re; E Stick, now Drivers (RetroRalph)
3. Re: Another Re; E Stick, now Drivers (RetroRalph)
4. Re: Another Re; E Stick, now Drivers (RetroRalph)
5. It's Magic! (Mahoney, John)
6. Re: E Stick, now Drivers (Sandwich Maker)
7. Re: exhaust pipes (Russell Neyhart)
8. Re: Another Re; E Stick, now Drivers (farna@xxxxxxx)
9. scam auction fee free to outbid me.... (Eddie Stakes)
10. Re: Another Re; E Stick, now Drivers (Keleigh Hardie)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Thu, 21 Dec 2006 12:13:36 -0800 (PST)
From: Tom Jennings <tomj@xxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] Another Re; E Stick, now Drivers
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.64.0612211209310.14075@unit>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed
On Thu, 21 Dec 2006, Sandwich Maker wrote:
> the problem is that you have to make them extremely precisely and from
> very hard materials to be efficient [because what you have is very
> much like a ball bearing] so that you can run very high contact
> pressures because slippage is death. monsanto even developed a
> special lubricant that turns solid under extreme pressure [santotrac
> iirc] but apparently the technology wasn't there yet or we'd all be
> driving them.
Yeh, that variable-ratio stuff so far works only on low
torque apps. Ball-and-disc integrators were used in mechanical
computers around WWII, where the forces were tiny, and still
slippage required all sorts of compensations.
The best "converter" so far is powersource --> generator -->
control circuitry --> motor. That's what locomotives do. It's
not cheap.
I think this really where "hybrid" technology will gain; it's a
really efficient way to transform energy. Its just complicated.
But complicated technology is what benefits from Fordism, look
how much complicated crap is in a desktop computer and all in all
they work really cheap for really long times for little money;
you just can't fix them.
I like really new laptops (might as well pot them in epoxy)
and really old cars (they come with technical service manuals!).
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Thu, 21 Dec 2006 13:00:46 -0800
From: "RetroRalph" <retroralph@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] Another Re; E Stick, now Drivers
To: <amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Cc: johnelle@xxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <005101c72543$1663e330$6400a8c0@ralphs1>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1;
reply-type=original
The Packard auto trans was called "Ultramatic" according to the trim on my
Uncle Herman's '55 Hudson Hollywood 2door hardtop with V8 & continental kit
and white leather upholstery. Seemd to me like everything was fine with
that big boat excpet for that Ultramatic Trans. I was 17 at the time and
worked one summer vacaton for him. He was Hudson dealer In NoDak.
Many photos of this era AMC at :
www.oldcarandtruckpictures.com/AmericanMotors/AmericanMotors.html
______________________________________________________________
Ralph Ausmann - Hillsboro, OR - > <ralph.ausmann@xxxxxxxxx>
http://clubs.hemmings.com/clubsites/classicamx/
----- Original Message -----
From: "John Elle" <johnelle@xxxxxxxxx>
> John Mahoney's Packards from the so-called modern era is or was as I
> understand it the only independent to develop there own fully automatic
> transmission in the 50's and was used by Nash and Hudson on the Packard
> derived V-8's I believe but it was a 2 speed automatic with a lock up
> torque converter used as a 3 speed automatic and some what problematic
> at best I believe.
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Thu, 21 Dec 2006 13:08:30 -0800
From: "RetroRalph" <retroralph@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] Another Re; E Stick, now Drivers
To: <amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Message-ID: <005b01c72544$2b21fcc0$6400a8c0@ralphs1>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1;
reply-type=original
Sounds like a Model T Ford... according to my Dad's Model T hot rodding
recollections way back when... I think it was controlled with a foot pedal.
There s/b info on that stuff on the web somewhere.
______________________________________________________________
Ralph Ausmann - Hillsboro, OR - > <ralph.ausmann@xxxxxxxxx>
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mark Price" <markprice242@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Someone and I can't remember who, was it White?, made a vairable
> transmission back in the 1910's that was a large heavy flywheel mounted to
> an enegine and the way the car was driven was the engine speed was a
> constant and you moved a lever which moved the drive along the face of the
> flywheel. Starting close to center for low speed and torque moving out
> toward the edge as speed increased.
------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Thu, 21 Dec 2006 13:32:37 -0800
From: "RetroRalph" <retroralph@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] Another Re; E Stick, now Drivers
To: <amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Message-ID: <007901c72547$896100d0$6400a8c0@ralphs1>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1;
reply-type=original
Seems like there's somehing to be said for the "old stuff." Like the
operator could tune it up on the fly... He had a manual choke rod and
could adjust his fuel air mixture as he drove along to get it set right.
also had spark advance/retard control on his steering column and his
throttle control was there also.
Some would forget to set the spark back to starting (retard) and try to
crank it up and maybe get a broken arm from it. But that only happened once
or twice as people usually could remember the pain... and they learned to
not hook their thumb around the crank handle when cranking up, too. They
generally needed those thumbs so they could milk their cows... No
store-bought milk out in the country. No money for it, either.
______________________________________________________________
Ralph Ausmann - Hillsboro, OR - > <ralph.ausmann@xxxxxxxxx>
> With old two-speed transmissions, this sort of tuning would be
> necessary. With a closed-loop computer-driven car with an equally
> smart 8-speed transmission there's no comparison possible,
> but as good as that stuff is I really like having my hands,
> butt and ears attached to the old stuff.
------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Thu, 21 Dec 2006 16:34:38 -0500
From: "Mahoney, John" <jmahoney@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [AMC-List] It's Magic!
To: <amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Message-ID:
<BFF496024CD8E8499845576906CA0F190D3026@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Mentioned (and in holiday scramble I missed reading it): AMC family E-Stick antecedent?
Not from the 1600s,
http://www.esper.ru/alh_img/magic_hand.jpg
nor from the 1960s,
http://www.backtobasicstoys.com/item/productid/3254/
nor from the last 60-minute cycle of news,
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/6193681.stm
but from N-K+HMC. Magic? No. Lectric? Yup.
A finger touch long before revolutionary mice.
http://tinyurl.com/hstbm
Kar kids kan find it in a big AM history book.
Magical "things they never saw before..." maybe.
http://mclellansautomotive.com/photos/B4327.jpg
You know them unless you were born yesterday.
http://mclellansautomotive.com/photos/B16739.jpg
Fill your '06 holiday season with '36 magic.
Shift Santa's sleigh to Hudson's Magic Hand.
In three years, Santa shifts to Drive-Master.
He'll be juiced on Red Bull and Turbo charged.
Now Dasher, now Dancer, now Prancer and Vixen!
http://www.desoto58.com/dreamcar/rambler/vixen1.jpg
Say "Now Santa has some AM-in-the-sky styling!"
http://www.rsportscars.com/foto/07/lexuslfa05_inter.jpg
Say "Now Lexus is the new 2007 lead reindeer?"
Remember "sleigh-of-hand" <groan> wasn't always a ToyoGeneral Octomatic.
Remember nothing is forever as well: sometime it's time to change gears.
>>
John Mahoney's Packards from the so-called modern era is or was as I
understand it the only independent to develop there own fully automatic
transmission in the 50's and was used by Nash and Hudson on the Packard
derived V-8's I believe but it was a 2 speed automatic with a lock up
torque converter used as a 3 speed automatic and some what problematic
at best I believe.
<<
(Father owned '55 and '56 Packards; my newest was a '49 fat boy woody
http://www.oldwoodies.com/img/4sale/jhigginson/49packard_060531.jpg
and it, too, never looked quite right for a burger/cola/fries cruise.)
http://static.flickr.com/49/137961028_20b80b06b2_m.jpg
but Twin Ultramatic, like Torsion-Level, may not have reached the height [!] of mid-1950s success that GM, Ford, Chrysler, and, for a brief shining moment, American Motors, had, but if you asked the engineers who worked in Saarinen's shining symbol of America's greatest age of postwar success [GM Tech Center], they said that maybe the Packard magic was even more magical than their own. The Powertrain Division could relax a little when the model year 1957 dawned.
>>
Now there is a big push to get the snowmobile variable speed automatics
out in the market. So far not overly successful. Audi, Saturn and others
in the last couple of years (now no longer offered). The Dutch Daf in
<<
Really? Only GM decided to ring in its new year with planetary gears.
Won't compose "Theme on Variomatic" but CVT's shifting into high gear.
Nissan, Honda, Toyota, BMW, Audi, Ford, and even DCX are among many magic makers today; tomorrow, the CVT may come to challenge the "traditional" automatic.
How little/lots Leonardo knew.
Life was so fast back in 1490.
If Nissan can translate Clio into Versa to turn out 5-star safety with an ultra-compact, class-leading MR18 power plant (while dummer DaimlerChrysler can't translate Deutsch into D-body to put a -finished- mid-sedan on sale [promised computer thingys and interior LED are now "late availability" selling points: imagine Accord or Camry ever being sold like that!] --- and Sebring isn't even pretty {can't Mopar simply knock off an Audi or Subaru design?} [Versa ain't pretty either, but it's -supposed- to look odd: it's a cheap hatchback {but couldn't Nenault knock off a nice VW or Seat?}]), if GM wants to be making cars --- and making money --- in 2036, it must again make magic also.
More must make more merriment.
Or, like AMC, make makes gone.
So, Seasons' Greetings to all.
Go forth. Make holiday magic.
If ya don't do magic: as they say, talk to the hand.
http://euromusicology.cs.uu.nl/img/guidonianhand.jpg
Count and/or sing along with Goodguy Guido d'Arezzo:
"Do-re-mi, bring a new A-M-C."
"Fa la la la la, la la la la."
For this Christmas, already!
This is now the year 1060.
Pacem in terris.
Peace be.
------------------------------
Message: 6
Date: Thu, 21 Dec 2006 17:05:52 -0500 (EST)
From: adh@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx (Sandwich Maker)
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] E Stick, now Drivers
To: mail@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <200612212205.kBLM5qZ24674@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
" From: Tom Jennings <tomj@xxxxxxx>
"
"
" The state-of-tune of engines has obviously changed wildly. People
" thought nothing of putting a car in far-too-high gear and just
" let it lug-lug-lug up to speed. My father drove everything
" from VW Beetle to V8 Chevy van that way. If performance isn't
" a concern, gas is dirt cheap, and no one sniffs tailpipes,
" it's a pleasant way to operate a car.
my grandmother drove this way too, even when it produced awful noises
[body resonance]. she'd make a face and say i don't know what makes
it do that, and i'd try to explain she wasn't letting the car go
faster before shifting...
she was -trained- to do it. my theory is that the cars she learned to
drive on had the off-idle torque to make it possible. and the
chauffeur she learned from was only concerned with smooth silence, not
strain or wear and tear or mileage etc.
my mother drove a variant of this, taught by the same chauffeur at
almost the same time - fine starting out in 1st but then she'd spend
only enough time in 2nd to engage the clutch before shifting to 3rd.
she could as well have skipped 2nd completely for all the good it did.
it took me a long time to break her of that habit...
early rolls royces - the ghosts and phantoms - could be shifted into
high at a walking pace -- and the '07 ghost was still good for better
than 60! but as near as i can tell they idled at less than -50- rpm -
unless the biographer i read got the chauffeur's manual wrong. [it
says 'before engaging clutch, increase revs to between 50 and 100
rpm']
" From: Tom Jennings <tomj@xxxxxxx>
"
" On Thu, 21 Dec 2006, Sandwich Maker wrote:
"
" > the problem is that you have to make them extremely precisely and from
" > very hard materials to be efficient [because what you have is very
" > much like a ball bearing] so that you can run very high contact
" > pressures because slippage is death. monsanto even developed a
" > special lubricant that turns solid under extreme pressure [santotrac
" > iirc] but apparently the technology wasn't there yet or we'd all be
" > driving them.
"
" Yeh, that variable-ratio stuff so far works only on low
" torque apps. Ball-and-disc integrators were used in mechanical
" computers around WWII, where the forces were tiny, and still
" slippage required all sorts of compensations.
"
" The best "converter" so far is powersource --> generator -->
" control circuitry --> motor. That's what locomotives do. It's
" not cheap.
this has historical roots too, though. and we're talking about
-really-high- hp density - holding steady now at 1000hp in a ~3' cube
traction motor - and efficiency is really important because waste
means waste heat, and it's hard enough already to get rid of. 1000hp
is ~750 kw; if it's 98% efficient that's 15kw -per-motor- the cooling
system has to dump when operating at full throttle. anything less
efficient would be worse, and in fact i believe this was a major force
pushing the industry to ac traction motors - the part that needs the
most cooling is on the outside in an ac motor.
now add in that steel wheels on steel rails have very low rolling
friction and a 1% grade is considered steep and most trains don't
operate in a stop/start environment, and the situational imperatives
are very different from cars. motors can produce tremendous torque
for starting, but your cooling system better be able to keep up if you
expect to do it more than once. either that or your drive-by-wire is
gonna have to hold the throttle back, and you know how motorists would
react to that...
i'd still like to see the numbers for a high pressure variable
displacement pump / variable displacement motor hydrostatic
transmission.
[just figured out the perfect car for a turbo apu / hydrostatic
powertrain - a citroen! ds/id or sm]
" I think this really where "hybrid" technology will gain; it's a
" really efficient way to transform energy. Its just complicated.
" But complicated technology is what benefits from Fordism, look
" how much complicated crap is in a desktop computer and all in all
" they work really cheap for really long times for little money;
" you just can't fix them.
i saw a total lifecycle cost analysis of lots of cars recently - wish
i could recall where - and their conclusion is that hybrids suck.
hybrid total lifecycle cost averaged per mile is higher than most cars
and even middling [h3] suvs. the loweat cost per mile - way below the
average - was posted by the scion xb.
[ps. toyota is selling all the xbs they can make, and making all they
can, and the demand is still so high 2yo used are in the $13k-$14k
range - so why are they gonna dump the present car and put the name on
something completely different when it comes up for redesign?]
________________________________________________________________________
Andrew Hay the genius nature
internet rambler is to see what all have seen
adh@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx and think what none thought
------------------------------
Message: 7
Date: Thu, 21 Dec 2006 12:07:06 -0500
From: Russell Neyhart <rtneyhart@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] exhaust pipes
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <458ABF3A.5040109@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed
Wayne,
Have you tried searching for the pipes on Advance Auto/Kragen/Parts
Americas Web sites? You also might try Maremont or Walker to get numbers.
Regards,
Russ from Pa.
Wayne E LaMothe wrote:
> Since the only place that makes exhaust pipes is over 30 miles away and
> the J10 has no pipes on it, I can't get the truck to them. Is there any
> place that sells old cars exhaust parts? NAPA does not list either the
> tailpipe or the intermediate pipe. I might have to bring my pieces in to
> see what they can bend up to match.
>
> Any leads?
>
> Thanks
>
> Wayne
> 66 Ambo 990 wagon, 327, auto, PS, PDB, PW, 69 Ambo 2 dr, 401 M12
> 83 Eagle Limited, 82 Eagle SX/4
> 88 J10, a real truck
> 2001 XJ, 2000 Cirrus (both hers)
> _______________________________________________
> AMC-List mailing list
> AMC-List@xxxxxxxxxxxx
> http://www.amc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/amc-list
>
> or go to http://www.amc-list.com
>
>
------------------------------
Message: 8
Date: Thu, 21 Dec 2006 23:11:53 +0000
From: farna@xxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] Another Re; E Stick, now Drivers
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID:
<122120062311.24676.458B14B800096FDF0000606421603760210E029D0E00@xxxxxxx>
The industrial versions of the variable pulley system ARE successful. We had a mid 60 combine (small one -- 200 Ford six, 28-20 foot header) that had that type drive. Many variable speed drill presses use it (the ones with a screw in/out speed handle that say "must be running to change speed"), and many other machine tools. Low rpm on the combine -- the pulleys changed size for load and engine rpm. Light load and high rpm it would pick up speed great (but relativley slow and steady acceleration) -- like drivnig down a road. In the field (pulling harder) it would let the engine speed go up and forward speed wouldn't change if there was a load. NEVER had a problem with the 2.5-3" wide, 1" thick drive belt. The gears would only change so fast though, that was the key. Quick changes and rapid application of torque would have burned the belt up. Belt life was a problem with cars bigger than the Justy, which was a 1.0L, or close to that. Didn't know about the Saturn.
The Dodge Caliber auto is a variable speed unit that works pretty much the same way, so is the new Nissan (which I think they call a variomatic -- same name as old DAF?). New leaps and bounds in belt fiber technology will make a huge difference -- belts with Kevlar or similar high heat/strength synthetic fibers, and even with stainless steel in them, should work better. I recently drove a Caliber. I thought they'd solved the problem by having a real first gear, because the thing accelerates then you feel a shift. After that it's variable. The dealer said the computer is just programmed that way -- holding it at a higer reduction for a bit then letting it go up reduces wear and makes the driver more comfortable. After that you can floor it and the engine rpm goes up a half second before the car starts accelerating -- more of what I exepcted. It's pretty smooth, but I told the wife I'd never buy one now. In a couple years, once they've proven themselves (or not!) I would. Don'!
t want
a Saturn variable drive experience! (GM is so prone to introduce things before they're proven) New it drives fine -- go out and test drive one. The only thing we didn't like was visibility. Wide door frames and pillars, especially in the back, look good but blocks view, especially to rear quarters. Might have to try the Nissan.
I remember reading in Hemmings Classic Car (heck, what was it before the name change? think it was one of those...) about the White. Low speed/power/compression high torque engine is what made it possible (like the combine described above). But there are modern applications. Snapper rear engine mowers use the same thing and run for many years. I think they still use it on the "classic" Snapper rear engien rider today. I don't recall any other name brands, but have seen similar riders with the same setup, even a couple front engine lawn tractors. Lots of old ideas getting explored again -- technology (such as flexible stainless and Kevlar belts) may make them more feasible now than whe they were invented. Like John Mahoney has said many times -- every auto maker needs an auto historian. Not only to learn from mistakes, but to recall old ideas that might be more workable now than when they were ahead of the technology of their times.
--
Frank Swygert
Publisher, "American Motors Cars"
Magazine (AMC)
For all AMC enthusiasts
http://farna.home.att.net/AIM.html
(free download available!)
------------------------------
Message: 9
Date: Thu, 21 Dec 2006 18:31:28 -0600
From: "Eddie Stakes" <eddiestakes@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [AMC-List] scam auction fee free to outbid me....
To: <baadassGremlins@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>, <mail@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Message-ID: <004401c72560$86407d90$abf1b148@piageedc1iqa5q>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
reply-type=original
Go ahead punks, double dog dare you to outbid me....my bidding limit has
been raised to $99 million. Hee, hee......
Item name: 1969 AMERICAN MOTORS JAVELIN AMX 390 A/C SHOW OR GO!
Your current bid: US $70,100.00
Your maximum bid: US $100,000.00
-----------------------------------------------------------------
Details for item number: 230069184967
-----------------------------------------------------------------
Item URL:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=230069184967
End date: Thursday, Dec 28, 2006 08:23:38 PST
Seller: lotwark
Eddie Stakes'
Planet Houston AMX
713.464.8825
eddiestakes@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
www.planethoustonamx.com
Email is currently HEAVY
5-12 day reply times, call if important
------------------------------
Message: 10
Date: Thu, 21 Dec 2006 17:40:14 -0700
From: Keleigh Hardie <keleigh3000@xxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] Another Re; E Stick, now Drivers
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <458B296E.20405@xxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
"Audi, Saturn and others in the last couple of years (now no longer
offered)."
I don't know about Saturn and the others (Nissan and Subaru among them),
but Audi still offers the CVT. In fact, they continue to offer it on the
larger, heavier new A6 with a 255 horsepower engine. Keep in mind, we
replace a lot of the transmissions under warranty, before 50k. The techs
joke that a 40k service on a FWD is replacing the plugs, filters, and
transmission. Luckily, the Quattros don't get that trans (where I am now
almost all the cars we sell are Quattros), and the TT and A3 have an
entirely different transmission, the DSG (direct shift gearbox). The DSG
is trick, a three shaft electronically controlled, hydraulically shifted
mechanical box with two clutches and no fluid coupling. The gears
alternate between two output shafts (both have a pinion gear engaged to
the ring gear) and the TCU pre-shifts into the next gear, and then
disengages one clutch and engages the other, almost simultaneously. It
shifts so fast and smooth, only the best drivers could compare, and
there's no hydraulic losses so the performance and efficiency are as
good or better than a stick. Really impressive.
"The Dutch Daf in the 60's"
One step up from a go cart. It actually had a belt drive.
Keleigh Hardie
amc-list-request@xxxxxxx wrote:
> Message: 3
> Date: Thu, 21 Dec 2006 08:49:07 -0700
> From: "John Elle" <johnelle@xxxxxxxxx>
> Subject: [AMC-List] Another Re; E Stick, now Drivers
> To: <mail@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Message-ID: <000001c72517$903582d0$a4dc0d82@john1>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> The Dodge fluid drive was as described, the Desoto version was a
> semi-automatic. It seemed to be reliable as I remember just clunky. You
> used a clutch to put it in gear from a stop OR it only had two forward
> directions available on the column shift. Low which was the 2nd gear
> position or second and high which was in the 3rd gear position and if
> you needed to shift from low to high you had to use the clutch. But if
> you drove it in high all of the time you just needed to clutch to put it
> there. Once moving which was a simple as stepping on the gas to shift
> from 2nd to 3rd you simply let up off the gas pedal and it would shift
> automatically. It would also down shift using a passing gear type of set
> up or automatically shift back to 2nd when you came to a stop. I really
> had no problems with the transmission on the one I had nor do I remember
> it being problematic. It was not a performance set up though.
> Also as far as I can remember, most over drives were free wheeling above
> a certain miles per hour, thus you could shift the manual transmission
> by simply letting off the gas from 2nd to 3rd and back as the over
> drives (I remember anyway) worked in 2nd and 3rd.
> Another variation was the complete non-synchromesh or commonly known as
> the Crash Box. To shift that set up on the move you had to become
> proficient at a skillful 2 step dance of operating the clutch in double
> clutch mode for down shifts and matching engine and road speed for up
> shifts in order to shift anything at all to get it into gear with out
> grinding or crashing the gears. Thus the knick name crash box. But once
> mastered well you could shift with out the clutch at all once moving. I
> drove one of those for many years.
> As far as automatics go, there were a number of automatics and
> semi-automatics from the late 30's on. Gm as mentioned with the
> Hydramatic and Buick's Dynaflow were all late 30's I believe. Ford even
> marketed one in 1940 or 41 but all sold cars were recalled and the 3
> speed re-installed. Chrysler and other independents (Such as Hudson) did
> the semi-automatic route and as mentioned over drives could be driven in
> a semi automatic mode.
> Not sure when the infamous B/W automatic was first seen, probably the
> early 50's as used by a variety of people and a number of pre-selector
> transmissions were around as a semi automatic dating from the early 30's
> such as the one used by Cord and I am sure others.
> John Mahoney's Packards from the so-called modern era is or was as I
> understand it the only independent to develop there own fully automatic
> transmission in the 50's and was used by Nash and Hudson on the Packard
> derived V-8's I believe but it was a 2 speed automatic with a lock up
> torque converter used as a 3 speed automatic and some what problematic
> at best I believe.
> All of these were efforts to eliminate shifting. An exercise relating to
> be an uncouth chore (which lead to the first Corvette being a 2 speed
> powerglide) which was also the reason why most if not all of the early 3
> speed manuals had a non-synchromesh low. Who in their right mind would
> want to shift to low on the fly? And it was also cheaper. Performance
> oriented 4 speeds were really late in their introduction here in the
> land of expressways and 5 and 6 speed manuals almost non-existent.
> Now I see ads for 8 speed automatics! What a change and a far cry from
> Buick 1 speed Dynaflow , the original and only slush-o-matic.
> Now there is a big push to get the snowmobile variable speed automatics
> out in the market. So far not overly successful. Audi, Saturn and others
> in the last couple of years (now no longer offered). The Dutch Daf in
> the 60's or so and one of the offerings in the Daimler Chrysler line up
> in the last couple of years.
> What next? A hole in the floor for a flintstone version of mystery
> drive?
> Have fun.
> John
> PS A number of those would be pure dangerous to place in the hands of
> the un-initiated in a drive it your self format.
>
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End of AMC-List Digest, Vol 11, Issue 49
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