AMC-List Digest, Vol 9, Issue 25

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Today's Topics:

   1. Carter BBD alternatives (jackbarncord@xxxxxxx)
   2. Re: Not the AM Macaren (Jim Blair)
   3. SX/4 sighting (jackbarncord@xxxxxxx)
   4. Re: 1971 Turbo Gremlin (Jim Blair)
   5. Re: 1971 Turbo Gremlin (Jim Blair)
   6. Re: Coil and leaf spring questions. (Jim Blair)
   7. Re: Not the AM Macaren (Tom Jennings)
   8. Re: Not the AM Macaren (RetroRalph)
   9. Central Coast Mini Yard Report (JOE FULTON)
  10. new Fresh Cherries Gremlin and Pacer color(s) out...
      (Jerry Casper)
  11. Fw: Ambassador webpage (Eddie Stakes)
  12. Re: Carter BBD alternatives (Matt Haas)


----------------------------------------------------------------------

Message: 1
Date: Mon, 09 Oct 2006 14:14:42 +0000
From: jackbarncord@xxxxxxx
Subject: [AMC-List] Carter BBD alternatives
To: mail@xxxxxxxxxxxx (AMC List)
Message-ID:
	<100920061414.17515.452A5951000BE0140000446B21603762230B9D010C029D0E0D050C0E06@xxxxxxx>
	
Content-Type: text/plain

Hey All,

Here's an update on my search for an alternative to the Carter BBD on the 83 Spirit (and others of course).

I purchased a used Holley 2280 that was claimed to be from a 1975 Dodge 318.  The carburetor arrived Friday via UPS and looks to be as advertised, used, but nice.  I planned to overhaul the thing no matter what it looked like.  The fact that is was dirty was a relief, just maybe it was unmolested internally.  The throttle shaft was tight in the bore, no slop and everything moved with little effort.

I had bought a kit when the carburetor was shipped on the previous Monday, but I needed to make a trip to Walmart and purchased a few chemicals for a soak.  I came home with two bottles of Gumout carburetor & fuel injection cleaner and two cans of carburetor & automatic choke cleaner.

To the Gumout I added one gallon of gas in a plastic pail and to this mix the carburetor completely disassembled.  An hour later I stirred the pot and scrubbed every surface with a paint brush, then a tooth brush and returned the pieces to the pot.  At the end of the third hour I repeated the process with the addition of spraying each passage with the carburetor & automatic choke cleaner.  

The carburetor base was disassembled removing the throttle plates and shaft.  Taking a die grinder I removed the piened area of the shaft to disassemble the outer most bell crank and install the same part off the Carter securing it with silver solder.  Now the standard linkage will work without further modification.

All the parts were removed from the pot sprayed off one last time with the aerosol cleaner and then blown dry with compressed air.  If looks are any indicator this carburetor is clean!

After the bath I found that the choke parts of the carburetor have been "messed" with.  The link between the choke plate shaft and the high idle cam was replaced with a chunk of wire, I'll have to make something for that and the high idle cam itself has been (ground on???) holy crap.  Well, it moves the throttle so we'll have to see if it works or if it is too far gone.  Worst case I bring it to work and have the boys in the tool room lay a bead of weld on the edge with the TiG.  

The choke on a 318 has the thermal spring mounted on the intake manifold where the exhaust cross over is located and the Spirit has an electric choke.  I made a template for a bracket that will mount on the center section of the carburetor right off two bosses big enough for ¼ -28 internal threads and extend down to the mounting area of the choke assembly from the Carter.  I don't see it needing to be more than 10 ga material, but I found a piece of .191 that will work.  There is a bit of carving to do and holes to drill & tap.

The re-assembly of carburetor went well, but I'm wishing I had found a Carter two barrel off an early 225 slant, things would have been a bit less trouble and the way things adjust on that carburetor is a little smarter, IMHO.

That's it for now, carburetor is back together and waiting for the high idle link, choke mount and it will be ready to bolt on.

Jack

------------------------------

Message: 2
Date: Mon, 09 Oct 2006 09:12:51 -0700
From: "Jim Blair" <carnuck@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] Not the AM Macaren
To: mail@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <BAY114-F2398613AC79EB2EB45B0D6AC160@xxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed

A: On the one Fiero I dealt with that was overheating due to trapped air, I 
drilled the head near the thermostat and put in a bleeder valve kit (from a 
Honda Civic) that let the air out. Redline Water Wetter was also conducive 
to dropping the underhood temps.


From: adh@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx (Sandwich Maker)
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] Not the AM Macaren
To: mail@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <200610080150.k981o5f09615@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>

" From: "John Elle" <johnelle@xxxxxxxxx>
"
" SNIP
" Also don't overlook how GM's V-8-into-I-4 adventures later
affected AMC.
" SNIP
" http://xjconnection.jtv.cc/engine_I4_XJ.gif
"
" I bought a 1987 Pontiac Fiero, something on the order of
12,000 miles or
" so, one year old, and less than 8 grand cash at the time. The
little I-4
" with some form of fuel injection a 5 speed (Believe it might
have been a
" Susuki)

might've been a getrag.  the later z34's box was, and there was
some
sort of deal there -- the nv3500 tranny evolved out of a getrag
design
made under license by muncie.

" and black. This was another example of the Generals complete
" inability to market a car. What a fun little beasty this thing
was.

oh yeah.  it was canned after the '88 year - when they finally
ditched
the chevette front end for the design it always should have had
-
because 'nobody wants a car like that'.  the next year, toyota
introduced the mr2.

if the fiero had lasted just a year or two longer they could've
added
a z34 model with the twin-dual-cam 3.4...  it's a popular swap
and
according to one place that does a variety of fiero motor
trades, the
3.4 has the best sound, if not the most power.

" Multiple re-calls on the thing having to do with overheating.
Another
" clever screw up. The radiator fill and the over flow tank was
under the
" hood.  It was situated lower than the cylinder head there for
any kind
" of leak or failure to burp the system caused an air lock in
the cylinder
" head thus no cooling, thus overheating.

the fiero wasn't the only car afflicted with this sort of
cooling
screwup.  some cars almost had to be stood on their bumpers to
burp
their coolant systems.
________________________________________________________________________
Andrew Hay                                  the genius nature
internet rambler                            is to see what all
have seen
adh@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx                       and think what none
thought

_________________________________________________________________
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------------------------------

Message: 3
Date: Mon, 09 Oct 2006 16:19:00 +0000
From: jackbarncord@xxxxxxx
Subject: [AMC-List] SX/4 sighting
To: mail@xxxxxxxxxxxx (AMC List)
Message-ID:
	<100920061619.781.452A76740000E7030000030D21603763160B9D010C029D0E0D050C0E06@xxxxxxx>
	
Content-Type: text/plain

On my way to LaGrange, IL, Chicago area for those that aren't familiar, I was passed by an SX/4 with Colorado plates.  I thought at first it was a Spirit.  Narrow rims made the car look a little odd at that altitude.  I got up close enough to make a positive ID, fancy lingo for I read the side of the car, and sure enough it was an Eagle.  Then I backed off a bit and noticed the almost six inch tall SX/4 on the lower part of the door.  Oops, guess I was just excited to see an AMC on the road.  I should have driven the Hornet, but instead I was in the Mountaineer with the wife, an old TV, groceries and the dog in her kennel.  Maybe that was why I didn't drive the Hornet.

If it was someone on the list, sing out!  I was the crazy guy in the dark blue Mountaineer. :-)

Jack

------------------------------

Message: 4
Date: Mon, 09 Oct 2006 09:21:27 -0700
From: "Jim Blair" <carnuck@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] 1971 Turbo Gremlin
To: mail@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <BAY114-F203BEB0E01E6A9868A2D4EAC160@xxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed

A: You would need to find a pre '72 Jeep with TH400 automatic and 6 cyl for 
the ring (and make sure they didn't swap a alter motor in) More likely to 
find one in a FSJ (Wagoneer or pickup) than CJ. I have pics of the Nailhead 
TH400 in my '73 J4000 (as I was installing my '77 AMX's 304) I also heard 
some Postal Jeep (DJs) got the TH400 and 727 after '71 with the smaller bell 
but have not been able to confirm. (I took pics and measurements of a 904 in 
a '72 DJ panel but lost them and the ice cream truck was stolen shortly 
after that)
   For the spring wrap, a solid bar between the diff and springs that is @ 
12" long will cut down spring wrap a LOT!


From: "Clarence Milstead" <cmilstead@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [AMC-List] 1971 Turbo Gremlin
To: <amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Message-ID: <001201c6e8e7$f0e819b0$a3f444cf@1r75r01>
Content-Type: text/plain;	charset="iso-8859-1"

I have a couple of questions that I need help/advice on. I see
people
talking about a "nailhead" hydramatic transmission for earlier
model cars,
will this transmission fit my 1971 bell housing and if it will
where is the
best place to get one? I'd like one with OD if possible. Since I
installed
the 3.55 gears I'm getting some spring wrap-up on a fast start.
Will just
adding another leaf to the springs solve the problem? Thanks.

Clarence Milstead

1971 Turbo Gremlin
1991 Chevy Caprice
1996 Ford Custom Van

_________________________________________________________________
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------------------------------

Message: 5
Date: Mon, 09 Oct 2006 09:25:29 -0700
From: "Jim Blair" <carnuck@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] 1971 Turbo Gremlin
To: mail@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <BAY114-F19DC0074DBE6BF7CC86375AC160@xxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed

A: The later TH400s and 4L80E were run with vehicle specific bells AFAICT. 
That is definitely true of the Jags at any rate. (I tried to find a nailhead 
version 4L80E to put in my J4000 but only found unipattern TH400s, and later 
Jag patterned trans)


From: adh@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx (Sandwich Maker)
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] 1971 Turbo Gremlin
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <200610060213.k962DfY27209@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>

" From: "Clarence Milstead" <cmilstead@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
"
" I have a couple of questions that I need help/advice on. I see
people
" talking about a "nailhead" hydramatic transmission for earlier
model cars,
" will this transmission fit my 1971 bell housing and if it will
where is the
" best place to get one? I'd like one with OD if possible. Since
I installed
" the 3.55 gears I'm getting some spring wrap-up on a fast
start. Will just
" adding another leaf to the springs solve the problem? Thanks.

this tranny is a th400 first used with the early-'60s buick
'nailhead'
[hence the name] v8s.  they had a very deep flywheel recess, so
the
converter housing on the tranny case was comparatively shallow.
thus
it is possible to make adapter rings to mount the nailhead case
to
different bolt patterns, and this is what jeep, jaguar, rolls
royce,
ferrari, and apparently landrover did.

jeep used them from '65 to about '73 or so, when they switched
to a
custom amc-pattern case.  they had adapter rings for the kaiser
'tornado' ohc 230, the '64-'71 232, the nash 327, the buick 350
[yes -
i've seen one], and the late amc v8/6 pattern.

no, it won't bolt to your bellhousing.  with the right adapter
ring it
will bolt to your block.  advance adapters also has a plate that
puts
a standard gm th400 onto an amc v8 block.

no, it doesn't have an o/d - though there are aftermkt o/d for
the
th400.

ferrari and rolls have used the th400-based 4L80 4sp, but i
don't know
if it has a 'nailhead' front or not.  landrover used until
recently a
nailhead-case something-or-other, but whether it's still the old
th400
or a more recent 4sp remains to be discovered.
--
the original hydramatic is a comparatively primitive 4sp auto
from the
'40s, maybe '30s.  [for instance, it has a 'fluid coupling'
instead of
a proper torque converter]  almost everyone used them, but
production
ended when the factory burned down about '53 iirc.
________________________________________________________________________
Andrew Hay                                  the genius nature
internet rambler                            is to see what all
have seen
adh@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx                       and think what none
thought

_________________________________________________________________
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------------------------------

Message: 6
Date: Mon, 09 Oct 2006 09:36:23 -0700
From: "Jim Blair" <carnuck@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] Coil and leaf spring questions.
To: mail@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <BAY114-F36C17C86F150812478EDCAAC160@xxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed

A: The XJ and Eagle shock mounts are on the diff and reversed from each 
other. (it takes minor cutting and welding to fix that and have a 1 piece 
shaft diff) The MJ axle has no mounts on it. They are on the spring pads. 
When I built my '87 Comanche to SOA, shock mounts were a minor prob. Since I 
used an XJ axle, I just drilled the driver's side bracket and bolted a shock 
mount on. I welded one on the pasenger's side. Eventually I will get the 
early FSJ front anti-swaybar plates sandwiched in between the springs and 
the diff, and use the anti-swaybar stud for my shock mount and torch the 
others off.
   Maybe I'll get lucky before then and get the Model 20 rear axle I want 
with 3.73 gears. (I'd have one today if I didn't have other expenses like 
Canadian Thanksgiving and needing new 33/9.50/15 tires to worry about. 
Costco has a sale coming up next week)


From: "Swygert, Francis G MSgt 436 CES/CECM"
	<Francis.Swygert3@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] Coil and leaf spring questions.
To: <rtneyhart@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>, <mail@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Message-ID:

<092D8CF6635129428E9B66DC582C3B3D01945CDF@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain;	charset="us-ascii"

Russ, most coil spring companies don't even make "straight" rate
springs
anymore. I've always dealt with Coil Spring Specialties
(www.coilsprings.com), but others here have as good a results
with ESPO.
I'd order the new springs 10% stiffer than stock. At CSS you can
just
tell them 10% stiffer -- they have charts for the springs used.
That
will improve handling without affecting the ride to much, but
will be
enough stiffer to notice.

For the back you can add a leaf or get new leafs, but I'd get
the air
bag type helper/overload springs. That will improve handling and
allow a
lot of flexibility. They just clamp on. An on-board compressor
is nice,
but not necessary. It's best to replace the included
nylon/plastic lines
with brake line though. The plastic lines will leak over time,
and can
be hard to get a good seal with when new. I didn't find a
listing for
the Eagle on-line, but check J.C. Whitney or call others. The CJ
or
XJ/MJ (Cherokee/Comanche) model should fit though. These guys
seem like
a good place to start -- they carry Firestone (you'd want the
"Sport-Rite" kit) and Air Lift (ride control) brands. E-mail for
exact
application. It looks like the XJ/MJ kit is identical to the old
Eagle
kit -- they use the same rear axle. The XJ/MJ kit has an added
shock
mount to relocate one of the shocks. The shocks mount
differently on the
Eagle, the relocation mounts shouldn't be needed.

_________________________________________________________________
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------------------------------

Message: 7
Date: Mon, 9 Oct 2006 09:45:02 -0700 (PDT)
From: Tom Jennings <tomj@xxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] Not the AM Macaren
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.64.0610090942470.25888@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

On Mon, 9 Oct 2006, Jim Blair wrote:

> A: On the one Fiero I dealt with that was overheating due to trapped air, I 
> drilled the head near the thermostat and put in a bleeder valve kit (from a 
> Honda Civic) that let the air out. Redline Water Wetter was also conducive 
> to dropping the underhood temps.

To all of my cars I add one of those "radiator flush kit"
things that's a hose bib adapter "T" that goes inline in a
heater hose. I also ignore the directions and mount it on the
"highest" heater hose, with the cap facing up.

To bleed air, I simply crack the flush cap. Since it's at
the highest point in the engine (by hose arrangement, or I
can lift it up) above the radiator, when the engine's hot it
works perfectly as a bleeder.



------------------------------

Message: 8
Date: Mon, 09 Oct 2006 10:03:46 -0700
From: "RetroRalph" <retroralph@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] Not the AM Macaren
To: <amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Message-ID: <00a001c6ebc4$e25c6060$6400a8c0@ralphs1>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1;
	reply-type=original

Well Yeah...  
I was beginning to think I must have been wrong all these years.
As a matter of fact I think I saw this on some instructions from on 
of the anti-freeze changing (flush and refill) instructions some 
years ago...

Good ol' Tom....
______________________________________________________________
Ralph Ausmann  -  Hillsboro, OR - > <ralph.ausmann@xxxxxxxxx>
http://mysite.verizon.net/res79g4m/ ... and "check the links"
 


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Tom Jennings" <tomj@xxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] Not the AM Macaren
> To all of my cars I add one of those "radiator flush kit"
> things that's a hose bib adapter "T" that goes inline in a
> heater hose. I also ignore the directions and mount it on the
> "highest" heater hose, with the cap facing up.
> 
> To bleed air, I simply crack the flush cap. Since it's at
> the highest point in the engine (by hose arrangement, or I
> can lift it up) above the radiator, when the engine's hot it
> works perfectly as a bleeder.



------------------------------

Message: 9
Date: Mon, 9 Oct 2006 11:46:50 -0700 (PDT)
From: JOE FULTON <piper_pa20@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [AMC-List] Central Coast Mini Yard Report
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <20061009184650.88391.qmail@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1

I dropped some scrap metal off at a local junkyard
today and naturally had to check for AMCs in the yard.
 The yard manager said he didn't have any AMCs but he
was wrong.

1973 Hornet hatchback 232/3 speed stick floor shift. 
Complete. rusty rear quarters. Drum brakes. Good
glass.  Doors look decent but have been primered so I
don't know if there is bondo lurking.  Interior is
shot but has good dash pad.

1980-something Eagle wagon.  Complete including wheel
fairings.  Rough though.  Did not check the door tag
because I couldn't get the door open. (broken
latches).

Let me know if you need anything.  These cars will
probably be there for a few more weeks, since they're
in the Mopar rows which rarely get tampered with.

Joe Fulton
Salinas, CA


------------------------------

Message: 10
Date: Mon, 9 Oct 2006 12:08:43 -0700 (PDT)
From: Jerry Casper <gremlingts@xxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [AMC-List] new Fresh Cherries Gremlin and Pacer color(s)
	out...
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <20061009190843.57784.qmail@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1

 The diecast Gremlins and Pacers are Wal-marts are in
their 4th color now, I just found a white Gremlin and
a black Pacer this past weekend. So there will be more
to collect. And with the Gremlins, you can collect a
VERY patriotic red, white, and blue  assortment now.
:) One down, many to go....

Jerry, in Virginia

__________________________________________________
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------------------------------

Message: 11
Date: Mon, 9 Oct 2006 17:02:09 -0500
From: "Eddie Stakes" <eddiestakes@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [AMC-List] Fw: Ambassador webpage
To: <mail@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Cc: baadassgremlins@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <013a01c6ebef$1f257f20$e8f3b148@piageedc1iqa5q>
Content-Type: text/plain;	charset="iso-8859-1"

Look everyone a Ambassador webpage. Anyone wishing to post something there contact Mark down below. Thanks. 
Eddie Stakes'
Planet Houston AMX
713.464.8825
eddiestakes@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
www.planethoustonamx.com
Email is currently HEAVY
5-12 day reply times, call if important
----- Original Message ----- 
From: mark h   mdh157@xxxxxxxxxxx


Gentlemen,

FYI:  www.amcambassador.com/ambassadors_for_sale.htm

It's a link from my main page.  If you have any additional info or cars you want me to add let me know.  Right now it is only Ambassadors but i will post any AMC product.

-Mark 


------------------------------

Message: 12
Date: Mon, 09 Oct 2006 21:27:12 -0400
From: Matt Haas <mhaas@xxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] Carter BBD alternatives
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <5.2.0.9.2.20061009211931.0281a840@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed

<snip>
>I had bought a kit when the carburetor was shipped on the previous Monday, 
>but I needed to make a trip to Walmart and purchased a few chemicals for a 
>soak.  I came home with two bottles of Gumout carburetor & fuel injection 
>cleaner and two cans of carburetor & automatic choke cleaner.
>
>To the Gumout I added one gallon of gas in a plastic pail and to this mix 
>the carburetor completely disassembled.  An hour later I stirred the pot 
>and scrubbed every surface with a paint brush, then a tooth brush and 
>returned the pieces to the pot.  At the end of the third hour I repeated 
>the process with the addition of spraying each passage with the carburetor 
>& automatic choke cleaner.
<snip>

FWIW, Gunk sells carburetor cleaner in gallon containers that works much, 
much faster than what you're describing. Granted, the last carburetor I did 
was worse on the inside (the car sat for a few years) than the outside and 
it was just a 1 bbl Holley but after everything was apart, it only took 
about 45 minutes to clean up all the parts. I also used a paint gun 
cleaning kit to get into the passages in the metering body. Also, this 
stuff doesn't stink too much and is no where near as bad for you (or as 
flammable) as gasoline (I still wore gloves and a full face shield).

I've also used Barryman B9 Chemtool in the past which is just hideous. It 
smells bad, took a loooooong time to loosen up stuff and made the pattern 
in the rug move for a few hours after I was done.

Matt


mhaas@xxxxxxx
Cincinnati, OH
http://www.mattsoldcars.com
1967 Rambler American wagon
1968 Rambler American sedan
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------------------------------

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End of AMC-List Digest, Vol 9, Issue 25
***************************************