AMC-List Digest, Vol 4, Issue 35

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Today's Topics:

   1. Re: amx disk brake kit for 62 classic (markprice242@xxxxxxxxxxxx)
   2. Re: 71/74 T stripe questions (Ray Mick)
   3. MI AMC (Mahoney, John)
   4. Funniest thing I have seen in a long time- ELECTRIC	TURBOS!
      (Arfon)
   5. Re: Funniest thing I have seen in a long time-	ELECTRIC
      TURBOS! (Tom Jennings)
   6. Back to the 50's (house-of-travel@xxxxxxxxxx)
   7. Re: Funniest thing I have seen in a long	time-	ELECTRIC
      TURBOS! (Tom Jennings)
   8. 71/74 T stripe questions (Nick ALFANO)
   9. Re: Funniest thing I have seen in a long time-	ELECTRIC
      TURBOS! (Sandwich Maker)
  10. Re: Rear end in a Classic (Frank Swygert)
  11. Re: Afghanistan! (Frank Swygert)
  12. Re: Funniest thing I have seen in a	long	time-	ELECTRIC
      TURBOS! (Frank Swygert)


----------------------------------------------------------------------

Message: 1
Date: Wed, 17 May 2006 6:45:55 -0700
From: markprice242@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] amx disk brake kit for 62 classic
To: amc-list@xxxxxxx
Cc: John Elle <johnelle@xxxxxxxxx>
Message-ID: <18333090.1147873555897.JavaMail.root@web24>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8

Now this is a well thought out answer!
I've looked into and am planning on low bucking some 12" discs on the front of the American. As usual the project is stalled by me doing to much at the same time.
But, On the front or rear without ebrake you can bling it up a bit at a lower price by using 13" Mustang Bullett style rotors and calipers. A pair of brand new Calipers can be had for less than $200 from Summitt, figure $100 each for drilled slotted rotors Then pads ETC: The mounting plates are easy to design and most metal fab shops have neat things like Lazer and water jet cutters now! Figure another $200-$300 to design and buy plates After all this you will be looking at $1500 with misc and a lot of time doing plate design and making it all fit. If you like doing that kind of stuff go for it. Savoy64 or 64savoy on AMCforums designed my plates, They mount 82-83 Concord/84-89 XJ calipers using 84-89 XJ caliper brackets. These go over 99 up WJ 12" rotors redrilled to 4.5" pattern and will clear 16" wheels easy and certain 15" wheels. I will have to sand down new brake pads slightly as the rotor is thicker, but I prefer this over turning down the new rotors. Since my American!
  has the Calipers in place I will have less then $200 in the upgrade with new rotors! If I ever get down to installing them.
--
Mark Price
markprice242ATadelphia.net
Morgantown, WV


---- John Elle <johnelle@xxxxxxxxx> wrote: 
> I think that with all of the input from a number of knowledgeable people
> it has been established that 4 wheel disc brakes are a doable situation
> on a 1962 Rambler Classic. But I think that one more shot at answering
> this is worth the time to write it because--------------
> The author did not want just any disc brakes BUT those that had ?The
> Look?




------------------------------

Message: 2
Date: Wed, 17 May 2006 09:39:55 -0500
From: Ray Mick <rmick@xxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] 71/74 T stripe questions
To: amc-list@xxxxxxx
Message-ID: <E1051D27-94E7-444E-BB6C-6E4FC009E856@xxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed

My black stripe is printed silver
On May 17, 2006, at 12:08 AM, Teamamc wrote:

> Do you know the correct fade for each color stripe. The white  
> stripes have a printed black fade, the gold stripes are printed black.
> What is the black stripe printed(white,gold,silver)? Is the blue  
> stripe a metallic color or just a solid blue color with what color  
> fade? Did they make a red stripe.
> Was a non-fade stripe original? What does a 71 stripe look like(not  
> the early wrap around fender early type
>
> Can anybody answer the above questions
> Bryan
> _______________________________________________
> AMC-List mailing list
> AMC-List@xxxxxxxxxxxx
> http://www.amc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/amc-list
>
> or go to http://www.amc-list.com

Ray Mick
Somewhere in Kansas
"The older I get the faster I was"
72 Javelin/AMX
72 Javelin R/W/B SST
71 Javelin
See my Javelin @
http://community.webshots.com/album/54361408pRyvWE

My RWB Javelin@ http://members.cox.net/jvlnnut/Site/Javelin.html

Mid America AMC
www.midamericaamc.com





------------------------------

Message: 3
Date: Wed, 17 May 2006 17:58:40 -0400
From: "Mahoney, John" <jmahoney@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [AMC-List] MI AMC
To: <amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Message-ID:
	<E8DF38ACFC17F94998DE284C5CE4582A02202B9A@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain;	charset="iso-8859-1"

Grille-gazers and pin-stripers should click on lots 0128 and 0130:

http://tinyurl.com/foxkb

That much big bad green should paint them a pretty pair of AMX/3s!

While they are learning car fact$ of life, click on II more AMCs2:

http://www.rmauctions.com/CarList.cfm?SaleCode=JS06#

You should get a charge from one and [(s)lime] green from another.

You would be wet if you don't know the correct AMC/Jeep car names,  

http://www.wreckedexotics.com/newphotos/weird/weird709.shtml
http://www.wreckedexotics.com/newphotos/weird/weird708.shtml 

because your punishment would be to hear Cher singing "Half Breed"

http://thursdays.com/pic200/cher2104k.jpg

and you would NOT be permitted to recline on Basketry Print seats.

http://www.bogleclassiccars.com/objects/cars/amcpacer/interior5.jpg

Chris will want to correct one of the captions on his Pacer photos,

http://faculty.concord.edu/chrisz/hobby/75-Pacer-1.html

because "Teague" is -Chapin- in that fastback-with-speedlines pose.


Since what is not on the web is in print, what's new with old AMC?

In the Spring '06 MCR, there is no AMC --- not even in their '60s-'70s induction article --- and no explanation.  Maybe AMC didn't build cars with carburetors then or maybe their restoration article didn't accept that AMC people restore "grills" rather than -grilles-.  In any event: another issue of another "everyman" magazine that forgot good old AMC.

In 5-6/06 HMN, a '75 Matador (that's an AMC, right?) in "Reminiscing" (page 56) was "never seen again" and "you won't get rich" collecting CJ/Wrangler (page 24-25 with a so-seventies AMC publicity photo), and you wouldn't even know American Motors was once a wagon power because there's absolutely no mention of old AMC in a piece on "Ford's Nutty 'Magic Doorgate'" (what was so nutty about a better idea?) on page 74.

Great grilles (p. 76-77); they don't know how to spell in AMC either!

But they do know how to sell advertising: for a '68 AMX (resto) asking $45,000 (408 AC), for a '69 SC/R (old resto) asking $29,500 (405 AC), and for a '77 Grem (26k, orig) asking only $4,800 (937 AC).  You want photos?  You pays 5 bucks.  (AMC people apparently don't yet have e-mail...)

Oh well, that's AMC.

"The first pictures of a new car appeared in 'Motor World' in December 1921 and the three vehicles displayed at the New York Automobile Show comprised the entire output to that date.  The event, in which ninety-two car manufacturers displayed their marques, occupied four floors at the Grand Central Palace, decorated with red velvet and gold trimmings."

So much for history.

Your mission, should you choose to accept it, is to list nine new names among them --- and, since no mission should be impossible --- to decide which of them would eventually have some relevance to good old Nash-AMC.

If you can't answer, you just could -explode-.

Dum, dum, dum-duh, dum, dum; dum-duh dum dum.

Bad-da dum.  Ba-da dum.  Ba-da dum.  Dum-MEE?



------------------------------

Message: 4
Date: Wed, 17 May 2006 17:01:10 -0500
From: Arfon <Arfon@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [AMC-List] Funniest thing I have seen in a long time-
	ELECTRIC	TURBOS!
To: amc-list@xxxxxxx
Message-ID: <6.1.2.0.2.20060517170037.03aa5f08@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed

A friend of mine (who is into SRT-4s) showed me a flame-fest on an 
SRT-forum.  Apparently some guy bought an electric-turbo and couldn't 
figure out why he wasn't seeing any HP increase on a dynometer.


I've never heard of an electric turbo so I looked online for one...  The 
first I saw was on eBay:
	http://i22.ebayimg.com/01/i/07/2d/75/65_1_b.JPG
	(if you don't own a boat, you probably wouldn't recognize it as a BOAT 
VENTILATION FAN!)

Here's ONE of the auctions:
	http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Electric-turbo-get-it-cheap-instructions-civic-si-dx_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ33742QQitemZ8067113294




This is a fluke I thought.  One stupid kid got taken...  So I did a quick 
search on google for 'electric turbo' and got sent here:
	http://www.autoaccessorystore.com/resource/turbo/electricturbo.asp

Look at the pictures, you'll see that it is a CHEAP plastic fan!   I REALLY 
feel for these dumb ricer-boyz.



------------------------------

Message: 5
Date: Wed, 17 May 2006 15:40:36 -0700
From: Tom Jennings <tomj@xxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] Funniest thing I have seen in a long time-
	ELECTRIC	TURBOS!
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <1147905635.5933.263.camel@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain

On Wed, 2006-05-17 at 15:01, Arfon wrote:

> This is a fluke I thought.  One stupid kid got taken...  So I did a quick 
> search on google for 'electric turbo' and got sent here:
> 	http://www.autoaccessorystore.com/resource/turbo/electricturbo.asp
> 
> Look at the pictures, you'll see that it is a CHEAP plastic fan!   I REALLY 
> feel for these dumb ricer-boyz.

Now I admit that that item is just SPEC-FOOKING-TACULAR. 2.2amps at 12V
-- wow! It's one notch above all those things we could bolt onto our
(front engine, rear drive, etc) in the past -- whirling propellers under
carbs, and even beats magnets on fuel lines.

The blatant lies and straight-faced deception in the ad copy is quite
breathtaking.


Though it might be fun to make a car that has ONE OF EVERYTHING on it --
JC Whitney light-up flashing swan hood ornaments, stick-on landau bars,
fuel line magnets, 12V turbos, clear spark plugs (clear distro caps are
just plain cool), quad exhaust tips, super-tall spring shackles,
multiple STP stickers, every wide mirror, interior gimcrack, curb
feeler, lightup hubcaps, ... a rolling museum of excessive
accessorizing! Hell, I'd pay to see it.



------------------------------

Message: 6
Date: Wed, 17 May 2006 18:56:54 -0400 (EDT)
From: "house-of-travel@xxxxxxxxxx" <house-of-travel@xxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [AMC-List] Back to the 50's
To: mail@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <20060517225654.33F15373F8@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"


Does anyone have any information about back to the 50's? I went on the website and I missed the deadline to register. I was planning on taking the 65 Marlin.  Can I go and enjoy or do I have to register. Is 65 too new?  I dont need a place to stay as my kids live in St Paul. As always all help is appreciated.  


Bargain Bob Petersen,65 Marlin,64 Classic (for Sale),75 Pacer
AMC Car Collector

_______________________________________________
Join Excite! - http://www.excite.com
The most personalized portal on the Web!




------------------------------

Message: 7
Date: Wed, 17 May 2006 18:28:25 -0700
From: Tom Jennings <tomj@xxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] Funniest thing I have seen in a long	time-
	ELECTRIC	TURBOS!
To: amc-list@xxxxxxx
Message-ID: <1147915704.20908.1.camel@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain

On Wed, 2006-05-17 at 15:40, Tom Jennings wrote:
> On Wed, 2006-05-17 at 15:01, Arfon wrote:
> 
> > This is a fluke I thought.  One stupid kid got taken...  So I did a quick 
> > search on google for 'electric turbo' and got sent here:
> > 	http://www.autoaccessorystore.com/resource/turbo/electricturbo.asp
> > 

It gets better.

If you click on MORE PHOTOS, there's the same ad text, but at the bottom
is a wiring diagram -- which if you wired it that way, would burn up the
added wiring, because the switch runs from the battery to ground! 

http://www.autoaccessorystore.com/blowerinfo.asp




------------------------------

Message: 8
Date: Wed, 17 May 2006 18:47:59 -0700 (PDT)
From: Nick ALFANO <71amx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [AMC-List] 71/74 T stripe questions
To: amc list <mail@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Message-ID: <20060518014759.66612.qmail@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1

Bryan,

I reproduce the only factory correct fade 71-74 AMX
T-stripe I have seen to date.  There is only one other
stripe maker out there that has a AMX T-stripe with a
fade and it is not correct although passable for a
driver.  The fade on all 71s and some 72s would have
been clear so the color of the car would show through
making up the fade color.  AMC did indeed make a red
stripe.  In fact, the NOS early 71 stripe that wraps
over the fender on the side that I have is red.  On
black, I have seen mostly clear and silver although
back then you could have ordered it with any of the
color fades they had.  From the stripe design engineer
I spoke to back in the mid 90s at an AMC show here in
Kenosha, there was never a factory installed non-fade
AMX T-stripe.  That was an aftermarket reproduction
that was sold by a few AMC suppliers.  This was from
the guy who designed that stripe.

Hope this helps,

Nick Alfano 
Alfano Performance
Kenosha, WI. 53142
262-942-8271 after 6pm central and weekends
262-308-1302

Message: 5
Date: Tue, 16 May 2006 23:08:33 -0600
From: Teamamc <Teamamc@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [AMC-List] 71/74 T stripe questions
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <002001c6796f$f2123c90$6700a8c0@FAST>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1

Do you know the correct fade for each color stripe.
The white stripes 
have a printed black fade, the gold stripes are
printed black. 
What is the black stripe printed(white,gold,silver)?
Is the blue stripe 
a metallic color or just a solid blue color with what
color fade? Did 
they make a red stripe. 
Was a non-fade stripe original? What does a 71 stripe
look like(not the 
early wrap around fender early type

Can anybody answer the above questions
Bryan


Message: 5
Date: Tue, 16 May 2006 23:08:33 -0600
From: Teamamc <Teamamc@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [AMC-List] 71/74 T stripe questions
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <002001c6796f$f2123c90$6700a8c0@FAST>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1

Do you know the correct fade for each color stripe.
The white stripes 
have a printed black fade, the gold stripes are
printed black. 
What is the black stripe printed(white,gold,silver)?
Is the blue stripe 
a metallic color or just a solid blue color with what
color fade? Did 
they make a red stripe. 
Was a non-fade stripe original? What does a 71 stripe
look like(not the 
early wrap around fender early type

Can anybody answer the above questions
Bryan




------------------------------

Message: 9
Date: Wed, 17 May 2006 23:56:48 -0400 (EDT)
From: adh@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx (Sandwich Maker)
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] Funniest thing I have seen in a long time-
	ELECTRIC	TURBOS!
To: amc-list@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <200605180356.k4I3umr18295@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>

" From: Tom Jennings <tomj@xxxxxxx>
" 
" 
" Though it might be fun to make a car that has ONE OF EVERYTHING on it --
" []
" clear spark plugs 

these actually have their place, in tuning the carb by eyeball - eg.
combustion color.  they were sold under the name of colortune...

of course, by the '60s few cars had adjustable carbs or need of such
tuning aids.
________________________________________________________________________
Andrew Hay                                  the genius nature
internet rambler                            is to see what all have seen
adh@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx                       and think what none thought


------------------------------

Message: 10
Date: Tue, 16 May 2006 23:47:26 -0400
From: Frank Swygert <farna@xxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] Rear end in a Classic
To: amcrelay@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID:
	<ADVANCES62IEAOeIiGX00000074@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain

On May 16, 2006 russ hathaway wrote:
> Also remeber the Classic is a torque tube set up, so
> your gonna have to hang springs. Why not consider that
> 4-link set-up that Air Ride Tech has for the Mustang.....Russ


But you don't have to hang springs, use the stock ones. The spring sits 
directly on the axle tubes in 56-66 big AMCs. The seat is held to the
tube by a 1/2" long 3/8" fine thread bolt. Just drill and tap the new
axle tubes in the right spot and put the stock springs back in (or
order stiffer ones). The bolt just keeps the spring seat from shifting
on the tube, the weight of the car really holds the spring in place.
The shocks keep the axle from going down far enough for the springs to
come out, and the brake lines. 

=============================================================
Posted by wixList Archiver -- http://www.amxfiles.com/wixlist



------------------------------

Message: 11
Date: Tue, 16 May 2006 23:55:36 -0400
From: Frank Swygert <farna@xxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] Afghanistan!
To: amcrelay@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID:
	<ADVANCES62ix4A2DreB00000075@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain

you have to admit, the H1 isn't a very practical street vehicle. Of
course I know it never has been, just a status symbol. I don't know
anyone who's actually used a civilian model for off-road work, though I 
do know of a couple companies that bought some military surplus soft
skinned models and refurbished them. 

There's only so much armor you can put on a Hummer! A direct hit from a 
shaped charge is something they can't protect from and still make a
vehicle of that size. Those shaped charges (EFPs) were designed to
defeat light to medium tanks and personnel carriers with more armor
than a Hummer could possibly carry. The onlything they can do with a
the hummer is protect against small arms, shrapnel, and other indirect
fire. I doubt the armor is proof against anything larger than a 7.62
(30 caliber, as in 30-06) round. 50 calibers should penetrate,
especially if using armor piercing rounds (standard ball 50 might). The 
problem was the original hummers had no armor at all, and they draw
lots of small arms frie when used as escort vehicles. There's a
compromise between mobility and protection that has to be drawn
somewhere. Hardened hummers are already losing a good bit of mobility,
can't afford to lose anymore! 


On May 16, 2006 Mark Anthony Sproviero wrote:

> Only the civilian H1.  Military H1 production will continue to run
high.  I saw some of the newer models that contained some good design
changes while interviewing at AM General a couple months ago.  However, 
they are still unaware of a lot of the threats to the vehicles.  I
tried to point out as many things as I could to them that I learned
while in Iraq last year.  I basically lived in an 1114 as a 31B and got 
to see many different types of attack damage up close.
> 
> Its too bad the military doesn't share more information with the
manufacturer.  They just give them requirements and not much else. 
They weren't even familiar with what EFP's (explosive-formed
projectile) were or that they were being used to defeat 1114's.  :(
> 
> 
> -Spro
> 
> -------------- Original message --------------
> From: adh@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx (Sandwich Maker)
> 
> > " From: Frank Swygert
> > "
> > " Well, I made it! Been here a couple days now. If anyone sent me
a
> > " []
> > " it's a bother just say so! I'll get a few pics of the various AM
> > " General prodcts driving around though... ;>
> >
> > speaking of which, i just heard the news that gm announced it's
ending
> > production of the hummer h1. sic transit gloria am general...


=============================================================
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------------------------------

Message: 12
Date: Wed, 17 May 2006 23:29:31 -0400
From: Frank Swygert <farna@xxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [AMC-List] Funniest thing I have seen in a	long	time-
	ELECTRIC	TURBOS!
To: amcrelay@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID:
	<ADVANCES62uMhvqgStM0000007e@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Content-Type: text/plain

Funniest thing is that there IS a real electric turbo. The thing draws
massive power to drive though. It doesn't porduce a lot of boost
either, and only at WOT IIRC. Something like 4-5 psi. Why only at (or
near) WOT? You'd have to control the rpm of the electric motor to ramp
up with the throttle, and that would cause a big heat build up in the
mottors and require a good bit of circuitry. When I was reading about
the thing I was thinking it cost about the same as a low end nitrous
kit, which would give more power, or even an STS remote turbo kit. 

Here's a link to an article, and there is a link to the main site at
the end. 
http://www.turbomagazine.com/tech/0406tur_knight/

I found this quote in the article, which explains why the remote turbo
works -- pressure in the exhaust system (and volume of flow). Those
thinking that the power is made by heat are just plain wrong. I never
did understand how anyone can think that the heat makes the power in a
turbo, it just doesn't make sense. I really don't see how heat
increases efficiency either, since a cooler charge is denser and will
create more power...

"? Turbos are not free power, as some will claim. A turbo is a
turbine-driven supercharger and to drive something requires horsepower. 
The turbine needs velocity, volume, heat and pressure to operate. *The
first three won't make any boost. It's pressure that makes boost.*  
The first three help with greater efficiency. The pressure in a turbo
is measured by the difference in intake manifold pressure and exhaust
manifold pressure. This is referred to as the exhaust-to-intake
pressure ratio. Most turbos operate at a 2:1-to-3:1 ratio, meaning that 
if 10 psi is in the intake manifold, the exhaust manifold will see 20
to 30 psi. (The GN operated on a 2.5:1 ratio and the 300ZXTT had a
2.7:1 ratio). Some racecars make PR better than 1:1, but they're still
making backpressure. Backpressure is a restriction, and a restriction
is not free power."

I bet the remote operates closer to 3:1 due to the distance between the 
exhaust manifold and turbo, but then once the exhaust pipe is
pressurized it's good to go.



On May 17, 2006 Tom Jennings wrote:

> On Wed, 2006-05-17 at 15:40, Tom Jennings wrote:
> > On Wed, 2006-05-17 at 15:01, Arfon wrote:
> >
> > > This is a fluke I thought.  One stupid kid got taken...  So I did 
a quick
> > > search on google for 'electric turbo' and got sent here:
> > >
	http://www.autoaccessorystore.com/resource/turbo/electricturbo.asp
> > >
> 
> It gets better.
> 
> If you click on MORE PHOTOS, there's the same ad text, but at the
bottom
> is a wiring diagram -- which if you wired it that way, would burn up
the
> added wiring, because the switch runs from the battery to ground!
> 
> http://www.autoaccessorystore.com/blowerinfo.asp
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> AMC-List mailing list
> AMC-List@xxxxxxxxxxxx
> http://www.amc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/amc-list
> 
> or go to http://www.amc-list.com


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------------------------------

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End of AMC-List Digest, Vol 4, Issue 35
***************************************